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PFT: Should Gruden be getting more heat?


beardown3231

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19 minutes ago, big_palooka said:

Their starting QB was Matt Flynn. Doubt they drafted Wilson to back him up lol 

Actually, it was Tavares Jackson pending the offseason/preseason. 

The Seahawks absolutely signed Flynn to his 3 year, $26m deal anticipating him being the starter. Wilson "won the job" as goes the narrative, though even Carroll commented late in the 2012 season that Wilson was playing "alright" while the pass offense was spuddering. If not for Flynn's bum elbow, he 100% would have been named the starter at least to open the year.

I never thought Flynn was particularly good, but Russell Wilson in 2012 was not peak Russell Wilson. Wilson was absolutely a 3rd round pick that the Seahawks struck gold with. The amount of coachspeak that Carroll had to engage in while hoping Wilson ultimately panned out gives that much away. 

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6 hours ago, NYRaider said:

Wilson's one SB victory was because of their elite defense. 

Yes, the point being made was that they could afford said D because of the cheap qb contract

 

no qb making 20mil plus has ever won a Super Bowl I believe 

Edited by BackinBlack
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3 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

I'm pretty sure Sherman, Thomas, and Chancellor were also on rookie contracts. 

I do think you’re right, and Bobby Wagner. 

but there dline was their highest priced unit. 
clemons and Avril where both getting close to 10’mil iirc, which was a lot relative to that time I think.

— 

drafting is obviously very important. 

but when you’re paying your qb so little, you can really bulk up your teams depth. 

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6 hours ago, big_palooka said:

Their starting QB was Matt Flynn. Doubt they drafted Wilson to back him up lol 

Yes that’s the guy! 
but come on no one knew Wilson was a future starter when they drafted him.  He was a 5’9 QB who transferred around in college.  No one thought he’s our future starter!

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2 hours ago, NYRaider said:

I'm pretty sure Sherman, Thomas, and Chancellor were also on rookie contracts. 

Which is exactly my point it’s not just about a rookie deal QB.... you need a bunch of other rookie deal players who become big contributors.

essentially you need 3 drafts of 1st-3rd great picks and a few starters in rounds 4-7 every draft 

Edited by jimkelly02
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18 hours ago, dante9876 said:

Thats an interesting take. I disagree with it. I guess it depends on the development of tua most. But texans about to give them another top 5 pick and they still got some cap space. They have resources to keep building it up. Tua would be the biggest question. 

Well, I'm not exactly blown away by their current roster and 4 of their wins came against the Jags, Jets and Bengals in which the opponents combined to score 23 points.

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12 hours ago, jimkelly02 said:

Yes that’s the guy! 
but come on no one knew Wilson was a future starter when they drafted him.  He was a 5’9 QB who transferred around in college.  No one thought he’s our future starter!

He didn't "transfer around in college". He transferred to a better program for his final season of eligibility. He led the ACC in passing, then dominated in the Big 10. The only knock on his game was his height, which at the time was still taboo in NFL scouting. Several people said he'd be the number 1 pick of the draft if he was taller, so the skill set was there.

Seattle didn't spend a 3rd round pick on him to be a backup. They recognized a rare set of skills and developed it. 

Schneider wanted to take him in round 2: https://www.nfl.com/news/pete-carroll-had-to-be-convinced-to-draft-russell-wilson-0ap2000000312949

Andy Reid loved Wilson as noted as well. 

Edited by big_palooka
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16 hours ago, jimkelly02 said:

Which is exactly my point it’s not just about a rookie deal QB.... you need a bunch of other rookie deal players who become big contributors.

essentially you need 3 drafts of 1st-3rd great picks and a few starters in rounds 4-7 every draft 

Yes, so to win in the NFL you need a front office that is capable of finding talent that fits an effective scheme throughout the draft. Which Gruden and Mayock have clearly failed to do. 

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https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/haberman-and-middlekauff/id1162534195

Middlekauff is obnoxious, but watches the Raiders and makes some really good points about Gruden and Ruggs usage on this podcast.

He make a good point that it feels like they have no plan for Ruggs outside go deep. No plan to get him involved and like he said, Derek isn't even looking at him in games. 

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14 minutes ago, big_palooka said:

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/haberman-and-middlekauff/id1162534195

Middlekauff is obnoxious, but watches the Raiders and makes some really good points about Gruden and Ruggs usage on this podcast.

He make a good point that it feels like they have no plan for Ruggs outside go deep. No plan to get him involved and like he said, Derek isn't even looking at him in games. 

For being touted as an offensive guru, I've been less than impressed by Gruden's play calling during his tenure here. 

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36 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Yes, so to win in the NFL you need a front office that is capable of finding talent that fits an effective scheme throughout the draft. Which Gruden and Mayock have clearly failed to do. 

Part of the problem I see is Gruden has final say. Mayock and others in the organization really liked Lamb reportedly. Gruden wanted his "Tyreek Hill" which didn't look like a fit when he took him and 1 game to go, has yet to find any use for the #12 overall pick. 

Gruden is not adept at identifying talent but has final say. That doesn't work. That's why you hire a guy like Mayock. Mayocks year 3 will be telling.

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