2022 Offensive Line

[HighCalebR]

Just kick the tires. You know vet min. What could it hurt?

[Sandy]

46 minutes ago, craig said:

Standard is that <4 yards on 1st down is a bad run.  Running for 2 or 3 on 2nd and 10 is pretty unambiguously bad.  

"We should run more" sounds great, but you only get so many plays.  If you aren't running plays that actually convert first downs, you don't get any more offensive plays until you get the ball back.  It's just hard to run a ton of running plays if they aren't actually producing first downs.  

Wear them down is a cool hypothetical.  But NFL defenders don't that worn down by 1-2-3-punt and then getting to rest on the sideline.  

 

I still disagree. If a back has one six yard run and one 3 yard run, he averaged 4.5ypc, which we can all agree gets the job done. But by your metric he failed 50% of the time.

What we need to do is get back down to three-down football. Settle for forward movement. 3rd and 7 gives you a lot more options than 3rd and 10. That, with this defense, will win us games until the offense can find itself and start getting those chunk plays we're used to.

[Norm]

1 hour ago, squire12 said:

Going off expected points per drive/ play, a 3 yard run on 1st and 10 is not a positive play for the offense. 

Neither is a 3 yard run ro set up 3rd down a positive play for the offense.

https://www.nfeloapp.com/analysis/expected-points-added-epa-nfl/

@Norm

Insert your gif on computers/ analytics here!!!!

 

[craig]

1 hour ago, Sandy said:

I still disagree. If a back has one six yard run and one 3 yard run, he averaged 4.5ypc, which we can all agree gets the job done. But by your metric he failed 50% of the time.

What we need to do is get back down to three-down football. Settle for forward movement. 3rd and 7 gives you a lot more options than 3rd and 10. That, with this defense, will win us games until the offense can find itself and start getting those chunk plays we're used to.

If running twice to set up 3rd-and-7 is your happy target, how often do you think you'll get the first down running on 3rd-and-7?  

[Sandy]

13 minutes ago, craig said:

If running twice to set up 3rd-and-7 is your happy target, how often do you think you'll get the first down running on 3rd-and-7?  

[AlexGreen#20]

The runs in the second half worked because we were running behind Mercedes Lewis. 

The IOL for this squad just isn't good right now, and the Vikings play their ILBs inside with their light boxes. 

[Refugee]

Although there was some rust, seeing 74 back and moving pretty well made me feel a whole lot better. Hopefully each game he keeps building back his reaction time and play strength.

The return of 69 could really bring this offense up a notch, especially because we will be able to get more creative with out TEs instead of favoring them on the line. We will see what level of play he returns with but I think it’s coming in a week or two. 

[vegas492]

Jenkins looked rusty in pass sets.  And he took out his frustration in the run sets.

And from what I saw?  That was pretty much the entire line.  Except for Myers.  Myers was all world one play and Hanson the next.

Newman wasn't good, but maybe he was average, with a nice plus run game.

I don't know what to make of the line, really, other than it is clear that they cannot protect for long right now.  But getting Jenkins back should help that immensely.

[craig]

Rusty Jenkins back still made a big difference.  RT was better, RG was better.  The pass-blocking wasn't great, but at least *sometimes* it was OK.  Very Vikings, it seemed to almost never be OK.  But yesterday there was sometimes decent time even on pocket snaps.  

I don't think the pass-pro is going to get to super-bowl caliber unless Bakhti magically both returns and is actually able to play well.  

I have no idea how to read yesterday's game with the run-blocking?   I assume that was first the bad Bears line; second the excellence of Jones and Dillon; and possibly only 3rd the excellence of the o-line?  Or, perhaps film will confirm that the Packer blocking really was pretty excellent?  I can't read that.  I admit I'm kinda nervous that we'll now think we've got awesome run-blocking; but that against a better line with a different scheme, we'll be shown otherwise?  

[vegas492]

3 minutes ago, craig said:

Rusty Jenkins back still made a big difference.  RT was better, RG was better.  The pass-blocking wasn't great, but at least *sometimes* it was OK.  Very Vikings, it seemed to almost never be OK.  But yesterday there was sometimes decent time even on pocket snaps.  

I don't think the pass-pro is going to get to super-bowl caliber unless Bakhti magically both returns and is actually able to play well.  

I have no idea how to read yesterday's game with the run-blocking?   I assume that was first the bad Bears line; second the excellence of Jones and Dillon; and possibly only 3rd the excellence of the o-line?  Or, perhaps film will confirm that the Packer blocking really was pretty excellent?  I can't read that.  I admit I'm kinda nervous that we'll now think we've got awesome run-blocking; but that against a better line with a different scheme, we'll be shown otherwise?  

The first bolded part...it isn't like the right side of the line could have looked worse than it did last week.  Yah, it was better, but it still needs to improve.  I have no issue with Jenkins, he will get better.  Newman, though, needs to find consistency.

Our run game worked because Jones was flying out there.  Jenkins was free to get to the second level with help from Lazard or from dumb stunts in side.  And Jenkins flat out mauled on the second level.  Lewis was so much fun to watch, too.  Runyan was better on the run game and he executed a few great combo blocks with Myers.

[craig]

I have a hard time seeing run-blocking on a TV game.  But Myers is a big guy, and when he's running, I kinda imagine he'd be a big object for a defender to get around.  Seemed there were a couple of replays where he'd be running into the second level, and even though he wasn't necessarily pancaking anybody or maybe even getting his hands on anybody out there, he was still a moving object that defenders would need to see around and run around somehow.  Newman and Nijman move well too.  Last year Nijman's rep was that pass-blocking scored much better than run-blocking.  I wonder whether perhaps he's got a chance to be variably improved in run-blocking?  

 

[Refugee]

Let’s ride!

 

[Refugee]

Still waiting on news on Myers to see if it was anything more than just cramping but I remain hopeful. If we can get our full line back, this offense will see improvement. Of course, WR is a problem right now but I loved what they did with what they had.

I’m absolutely not a fan of the rotation at LT but whatever works for now. I understand the idea of easing 69 back and Yosh has played admirably, but we need the line to be playing together as one. Get those snaps together and form like Voltron. I noticed 89 on the left side quite a bit to help but if we can get back to what we once had, 69 should not need much help.

Big win today but questions remain. 
 

*official split between Bak and Yosh 35/27. Hanson played just 3 snaps at center and word is Myers could have gotten back if he worked out the cramping issues. 

Edited September 26, 2022 by Refugee

[Mazrimiv]

On 9/19/2022 at 2:51 PM, craig said:

I don't think the pass-pro is going to get to super-bowl caliber unless Bakhti magically both returns and is actually able to play well.  

[craig]

I wonder how much development and cross-training happens for bench guys during the season? 

1. Walker is a big guy with potential size for guard.  Might he be learning guard, and be ready to compete there by next season?  
2. Tom worked tackle and guard in camp.  Might Tom perhaps now be training some center?  If so, might he win the backup-center role from Hanson by next year?  Maybe even this year?  (I admit Myers going out on Sunday brought to mind questions about depth behind him.).