chisoxguy7 Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 5 hours ago, dll2000 said: He didn’t adequately prepare for the season due to reasons and it affected him. Just goes to show that using the "personal reasons" excuse can only be interpreted as being REAL bad. Nate Davis had personal reasons, said what was going on, it was a normal thing, and people moved on. Alan Williams had to have been real deep in something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dll2000 Posted March 19 Author Share Posted March 19 5 minutes ago, chisoxguy7 said: Just goes to show that using the "personal reasons" excuse can only be interpreted as being REAL bad. Nate Davis had personal reasons, said what was going on, it was a normal thing, and people moved on. Alan Williams had to have been real deep in something. I think the allegation was fairly severe. Enough to fire him immediately. They left it at 'Inappropriate Conduct'. You never know the truth of these things and what really happened as we are never shown the evidence or when we are it is never all of it. He hasn't fought any of it or complained of it to date. Or publicly declared he is innocent that I have seen. He just quietly left. So there is that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StLunatic88 Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 1 hour ago, dll2000 said: I say for them to be right than my standard is he has to be better than Fields best passing season and show upside potential. The Bears have made the choice to go with Caleb, and it seems like almost everyone on here is either happy with it or understands it and has accepted the direction we are going (and cheering it on). But this is nothing but stacking the deck in your corners favor... Did Field ever have the weapons that Caleb is going to walk in here with? I mean are we really going to pretend that Keenan Allen + Gerald Everett + likely a pretty impressive Rookie WR even remotely compare to Darnell Mooney (clearly still recovering) + Robert Tonyan + ESB? Are we going to pretend that if we add another Center (Bates is probably already better) and possibly other talent along the OL, was the same as what Fields was playing behind? And with what we watched go on from Getsy, basically Offensive Malpractice, is going to be the same as what we except out of what what lauded as one of the better Coordinator signings this offseason in Shane Waldron? Because if this one is the case especially, then we made a HUGE mistake Once again, the argument was NEVER "Caleb Williams vs Justin Fields" not by any rational person. It was Caleb Williams vs Justin Fields PLUS the massive haul to build up the rest of the roster (ON TOP of the type of moves we made this offseason so far, that would also help Fields the way its going to help Caleb) If you were on the Caleb side (or Rookie QB contract side) then you shouldnt even be acknowledging these type of people, unless there is still a part of you that isnt sure it was the right move Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEAR FACE DOWN ARROW Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 6 minutes ago, StLunatic88 said: The Bears have made the choice to go with Caleb, and it seems like almost everyone on here is either happy with it or understands it and has accepted the direction we are going (and cheering it on). But this is nothing but stacking the deck in your corners favor... Did Field ever have the weapons that Caleb is going to walk in here with? I mean are we really going to pretend that Keenan Allen + Gerald Everett + likely a pretty impressive Rookie WR even remotely compare to Darnell Mooney (clearly still recovering) + Robert Tonyan + ESB? Are we going to pretend that if we add another Center (Bates is probably already better) and possibly other talent along the OL, was the same as what Fields was playing behind? And with what we watched go on from Getsy, basically Offensive Malpractice, is going to be the same as what we except out of what what lauded as one of the better Coordinator signings this offseason in Shane Waldron? Because if this one is the case especially, then we made a HUGE mistake Once again, the argument was NEVER "Caleb Williams vs Justin Fields" not by any rational person. It was Caleb Williams vs Justin Fields PLUS the massive haul to build up the rest of the roster (ON TOP of the type of moves we made this offseason so far, that would also help Fields the way its going to help Caleb) If you were on the Caleb side (or Rookie QB contract side) then you shouldnt even be acknowledging these type of people, unless there is still a part of you that isnt sure it was the right move Agree completely, using Fields as benchmark isn't fair to him, and it isn't fair to Rookie QB. I could care less about wins and production this year, what I want to see is that the rookie shows flashes, shows progress and is able to operate the offense, as well as not showing fatal flaws. I'm excited thinknig about "maybe they could playoffs?" but it really doesn't matter for the team long term. The team needs to show that they chose the right rookie, and have put the right framework around him. Anything else is icing. *Fields did indeed get bungled by the Bears, in lots of different ways but always they did badly by him. You could make a list of QBs with worse situations (Bryce Young has got to be up there) but I think it's approaching 2017 levels of "bad plan" 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dll2000 Posted March 19 Author Share Posted March 19 I'm arguing with people who have a talking point they are spouting it all over X. Caleb has to be greatest QB in history immediately because that is what people advocating we draft him promised. "You said he was generational so that is what we expect." If you want to say we should have kept Fields and the value of trade for 1.1 that is fine. That is not an illogical argument. I am not going to relitigate the trade Fields versus keep him and add the value of trade no. 1 arguments. You can go back and see them all on here. But don't say Caleb has to be all world out of the gate when Fields never achieved his potential with the Bears. Those are people I have an issue with (I don't really personally care all that much, but out of just for fun online debating and work procrastination). I am arguing if you are arguing Fields was a great football player, why can't that greatness be the standard? I just want them to admit that Fields objectively wasn't that good. Maybe he will be at some point in future. But to date? He has not been. By any objective measure. He has been really good in individual games, but not as an overall body of work. Trubisky had some great games too. Not that I don't think Fields is better than Trubisky, but just to illustrate. And I have to indict myself in that. I argued at draft and following 2 years he was going to be good. I hate to eat crow to my dad who has been saying he is bad from draft. That wasn't fun. Tons of Packers fans get to gloat to me. I said Love wasn't that good and Fields would end up better. That hasn't been fun to admit. I am wrong all the time. Difference is I will admit it after it becomes clear. I 100% agree no one could have succeeded in '21 or '22 at QB. No one. But Bears had sufficient talent in '23 for a good QB to succeed and look good. 2023 was Fields try out. It was fair. And he didn't pass. The entire league and Poles came to same conclusion. Here we are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StLunatic88 Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 40 minutes ago, dll2000 said: The entire league and Poles came to same conclusion. Here we are. I mean this is a fun little flag that your side of the argument likes to fly. But its not only out of context, its not really true. 41 minutes ago, dll2000 said: I 100% agree no one could have succeeded in '21 or '22 at QB. No one. But Bears had sufficient talent in '23 for a good QB to succeed and look good. 2023 was Fields try out. It was fair. And he didn't pass. You know how I know this isnt true, because if we were picking #5 we wouldnt have trading Fields and picking JJ McCarthy. Heck, if we were picking #2, its pretty likely that Fields would still be our QB. What Ryan Poles pulled off, is likely the ONLY scenario that Justin Fields isnt the Bears QB for 2024. And thats where we are, and thats great. But constantly trying to find another win in the Fields conversation is just so odd to me 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dll2000 Posted March 19 Author Share Posted March 19 12 minutes ago, StLunatic88 said: I mean this is a fun little flag that your side of the argument likes to fly. But its not only out of context, its not really true. You know how I know this isnt true, because if we were picking #5 we wouldnt have trading Fields and picking JJ McCarthy. Heck, if we were picking #2, its pretty likely that Fields would still be our QB. What Ryan Poles pulled off, is likely the ONLY scenario that Justin Fields isnt the Bears QB for 2024. And thats where we are, and thats great. But constantly trying to find another win in the Fields conversation is just so odd to me I think if we are picking 2 Justin is still gone. If we are picking 9 he might be here. My side. It's not us and them or me and you. I have my opinion and I defend it. I am on Bears side. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEAR FACE DOWN ARROW Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 It's really going to complicate things if the Bears end up taking not-Caleb Williams in the draft. Which rookie QB would have you still moving on from Fields? Honestly for me it's Williams, but I could see the Bears going for Maye or possibly McCarthy. Taking either of the latter means nonstop attention and calls for your heads the first INT though. Whereas with Calen we'll give it to the second INT or first pick 6. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sugashane Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 2 hours ago, BEAR FACE DOWN ARROW said: It's really going to complicate things if the Bears end up taking not-Caleb Williams in the draft. Which rookie QB would have you still moving on from Fields? Honestly for me it's Williams, but I could see the Bears going for Maye or possibly McCarthy. Taking either of the latter means nonstop attention and calls for your heads the first INT though. Whereas with Calen we'll give it to the second INT or first pick 6. I'd have easily moved on from Fields in this situation for Williams or Maye. Daniels gives me some serious doubts but he might wow me in an interview. Love his accuracy when he is on and he throws all over eather than fink and dunking. Anyone else would mean a pretty fair trade down to take a QB. I'd likely take MHJ without much thought in a trade down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madmike90 Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 Has got to be the first time in history we have been top 3 when it comes to our receivers total career yards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuskieBear Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 3 minutes ago, Madmike90 said: Has got to be the first time in history we have been top 3 when it comes to our receivers total career yards. CW walking into a terrible situation smh #firepoles 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epyon Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 (edited) On 3/19/2024 at 4:25 PM, BEAR FACE DOWN ARROW said: It's really going to complicate things if the Bears end up taking not-Caleb Williams in the draft. Which rookie QB would have you still moving on from Fields? Honestly for me it's Williams, but I could see the Bears going for Maye or possibly McCarthy. Taking either of the latter means nonstop attention and calls for your heads the first INT though. Whereas with Calen we'll give it to the second INT or first pick 6. Likely an unpopular opinion, but any of Williams, Maye, Daniels, or McCarthy.... Maybe even Penix or Nix. I was just completely out on Fields, personally, so it wasn't a matter of IF we where drafting someone new, it was just WHO. None of that is to be construed as a ringing endorsement of any of those guys, however... If I where forced to pick amongst the rest, I'd probably go Maye for ceiling, but admittedly I haven't watched enough McCarthy film. Nix would be my absolute last resort...... Penix and Daniels I think both have major flaws but would be in the mix. but yeah.... I'd have played this season with Tyson Bagent starting, before I went back out there with Fields..... and I can fully admit that Bagent doesn't have an NFL arm. Edited March 21 by Epyon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sugashane Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 On 3/19/2024 at 3:09 PM, StLunatic88 said: You know how I know this isnt true, because if we were picking #5 we wouldnt have trading Fields and picking JJ McCarthy. Heck, if we were picking #2, its pretty likely that Fields would still be our QB. IDK. I feel like Poles would still want HIS guy and if he felt Maye or Daniels offered a better chance at winning consistently then he'd have zero issues shipping Fields out. If you talk to all of the 32 GMs I'd be surprised if more than 1-2 would choose Fields over Maye as of this year. Probably the same for Daniels. As a prospect even, since GMs picked Wilson, Lance, and some favored Mac over him as well I am skeptical that Fields would be anything more than fighting for QB3 here as well. I just don't see why a GM who didn't draft him and put him in a pretty bad situation as the franchise was rebuilt would want to stick with him when Maye or Daniels is right there - especially with more years of favorable contract control available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StLunatic88 Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 6 hours ago, Sugashane said: IDK. I feel like Poles would still want HIS guy But there was no rule or promise that “his guy” had to come this year. I like Maye a whole lot, I think in the long term he might be the best QB in this draft. But this team showed it had the makings of a playoff contender, and it would absolutely be a step backwards to go from what Justin Fields was actually giving you in Sundays to what you will likely have to work though with Maye for a few years. And I’ve watched a whole lot of Jayden Daniel’s in college, the fact that he is being talked about as #2 is baffling to me. Great and exciting college player. Not an NFL QB. Neither of those guys would be able to be as good as Justin is right now, but the issue becomes you get those guys for 5 years and JF only for 2. That’s why OTHER teams would pick them over Fields, while he was alr was entrenched here. But if you were never planning to commit to Justin long term, you can roll with him another 2 seasons while the rest of the roster is great, and you have built up amazing draft capital for whatever QB you want to go get (Vet or Rookie) when that becomes available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuskieBear Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 22 minutes ago, StLunatic88 said: And I’ve watched a whole lot of Jayden Daniel’s in college, the fact that he is being talked about as #2 is baffling to me. Great and exciting college player. Not an NFL QB. he's a skinnier justin fields. some of the hits he took in college are just hilarious Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.