MrOaktown_56 Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 29 minutes ago, Rich7sena said: But instead of taking out a defensive lineman (Ellis), a linebacker comes off the field -- meaning true second level linebackers are going to see more snaps in base if Guenther carrie over his scheme. Hmm. This definitely would shift around draft priorities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dessie Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 (edited) 46 minutes ago, Rich7sena said: But instead of taking out a defensive lineman (Ellis), a linebacker comes off the field -- meaning true second level linebackers are going to see more snaps in base if Guenther carrie over his scheme. Are you saying Guenther keeps Ellis on the field on 3rd down cos I doubt that? Guenther plays a lot of nickel defense though doesn’t he? He also likes versatile defenders that can play various roles. Irvin fits that bill. He had Michael Johnson play DE in base and DT in nickel. Edited January 7, 2018 by Dessie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich7sena Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 18 minutes ago, Dessie said: Are you saying Guenther keeps Ellis on the field on 3rd down cos I doubt that? Guenther plays a lot of nickel defense though doesn’t he? He also likes versatile defenders that can play various roles. Irvin fits that bill. He had Michael Johnson play DE in base and DT in nickel. Let me phrase it better: Gunther's base defense (which still occupies 40-50% of defensive snaps) uses 3 second level linebackers instead of 2. I'd characterize the Raiders base defense as a 3-4 or 5-2. Guenther runs a balanced 4-3 base. From what I can tell, Guenther personnel matches with the offense (2 receivers=base, 3 receivers=nickel, etc.). The closest player to Irvin in the Bengals roster is Carl Lawson, who comes situationally against the pass. The only way I think Irvin stays on is if he takes a pay cut to play a traditional OLB role. I don't think he's good enough a pass rusher, otherwise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJ Raider Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 Does he blitz a fair amount? Not sure if I can deal with a vanilla d again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daineraider Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 1 hour ago, Rich7sena said: It's hard to imagine Irvin isn't cut without schematic accommodations or a pay cut. Ultimately, the coin flip might be a big deciding factor if the Raiders can even pick Smith; I imagine he'll also high on John Lynch's board. I like Rahsaan Evans too. Not sure I like him top 10; but I like him a lot. Smith will be up there on several Big Boards. I see Lynch going OL or skill players to put around Jimmy. Will be a fun draft with quite a few blue chip players this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich7sena Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 24 minutes ago, NJ Raider said: Does he blitz a fair amount? Not sure if I can deal with a vanilla d again. From what I can tell: no. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJ Raider Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 Well I would assume he is at least good at disguising coverages and what not. Bengals d was usually pretty solid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silver&Black88 Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 Tried reading up on Guenther a bit: Quote Guenther has moved on from Cincinnati to take the defensive coordinator gig with the Raiders under Jon Gruden. Guenther did a decent job with the Bengals’ defense, especially considering the immense shoes Mike Zimmer left, but they never seemed to be a complete group from 2014-2017. If they forced turnovers, they couldn’t get to the passer and vice-versa. If they could get to the passer, they couldn’t stop the run (see 2017). Injuries played a role in these ups-and-downs, but there still is a slight sense of underachievement from the unit who always seemed to finish in the top-five in all categories under Zimmer. https://www.cincyjungle.com/2018/1/7/16856842/bengals-mailbag-defensive-coordinator-options-tyler-eifert-future-qb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raidr4life Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 11 minutes ago, Silver&Black88 said: Tried reading up on Guenther a bit: https://www.cincyjungle.com/2018/1/7/16856842/bengals-mailbag-defensive-coordinator-options-tyler-eifert-future-qb Yeah statistically he's had them in the in the top 20 in total defense, sort of middle pack, bend but don't break, including a top 10 run D one year 2 years with really good pass defense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dessie Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Rich7sena said: Let me phrase it better: Gunther's base defense (which still occupies 40-50% of defensive snaps) uses 3 second level linebackers instead of 2. I'd characterize the Raiders base defense as a 3-4 or 5-2. Guenther runs a balanced 4-3 base. From what I can tell, Guenther personnel matches with the offense (2 receivers=base, 3 receivers=nickel, etc.). The closest player to Irvin in the Bengals roster is Carl Lawson, who comes situationally against the pass. The only way I think Irvin stays on is if he takes a pay cut to play a traditional OLB role. I don't think he's good enough a pass rusher, otherwise. So nickel defense 50-60%? I think it’s more than that looking at the snap counts tbh. Irvin could quite easily play SLB in base and DE in nickel. That’s what he did in Seattle. The question is whether we pay him $8m a year to do it. Edited January 7, 2018 by Dessie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silver&Black88 Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 16 minutes ago, raidr4life said: Yeah statistically he's had them in the in the top 20 in total defense, sort of middle pack, bend but don't break, including a top 10 run D one year 2 years with really good pass defense. That's spot on for the impression I had of him as well. I'm interested to see what he can do with our personnel. Wonder if we try to improve our LBs as @Rich7sena has alluded to. Or maybe try to find a Geno Atkins type? (yes I know Geno's don't grow on trees lol) . On that note, how do guys on here feel about Hurst? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, daineraider said: Yep, re-sign Bowman and draft Smith(should have been Foster last year). And Jack the year before that. Edited January 7, 2018 by big_palooka Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 1 hour ago, NJ Raider said: Does he blitz a fair amount? Not sure if I can deal with a vanilla d again. Not blitzing doesn't make a defense vanilla. That's complete misguided. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raidr4life Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 7 minutes ago, big_palooka said: And Jack the year before that. Man the best Linebacker in the entire draft fell past us 2 years in a row despicable. I'm not hating on Reggie but I have been looking back on his drafts and there are a few wtf moments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 1 minute ago, raidr4life said: Man the best Linebacker in the entire draft fell past us 2 years in a row despicable. I'm not hating on Reggie but I have been looking back on his drafts and there are a few wtf moments. And Musgrave was pounding the table for Derrick Henry. Reggie's gotten a pass because of the 2014 class. But he's been pedestrian since otherwise. I'm excited to see some shakeup in the FO and for Gruden I'm sure to have his say on players that fit his system. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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