Random Packer News & Notes

[vegas492]

1 minute ago, Fl0nkerton said:

Fans usually resort to blaming the refs as their last excuse.

Unless it's an obvious miss like the NFC Championship last year, they will point the finger at every excuse besides getting beat. Whatever helps them cope with losing.

I went into the video feeling that way.

Didn't get that feeling coming away from the video.

Came away almost proud that GB is cited for developing a new and effective blocking technique.  Seems like they found a way to help neutralize edge rushers who use their hands really well.

[Joe]

16 minutes ago, Leader said:

Kamara's has played in 32 of 33 games.
Jones has played in 25 of 33 games.

...that's my point. If Jones is given the opportunities Kamara has had, he's probably the more productive back.

 

3 minutes ago, vegas492 said:

I'm unsure if Jones gets a long term deal.  He's been injury prone, and I still don't feel like he's a pass protector.

And Kamara?  Kamara runs routes like a WR.

I'm unsure if Aaron is on that level as a receiving threat as of now.

because we haven't exactly seen it. Kamara has had the benefit of being in one offense his entire career. Jones has been given a more challenging hand than Kamara.

[Shanedorf]

7 minutes ago, vegas492 said:

Seems like they found a way to help neutralize edge rushers who use their hands really well.

Teams talk to the Refs before every game, tell them what to look for. That's likely why Kenny Clark got the defensive holding call early on vs the bears
The bears told the refs to keep an eye out for it

IF the Packers OL were actually holding, the opponents and refs would do something about it. What it comes down to is that dork fans don't understand the intricacies of NFL blocking, but assume they do.

[vegas492]

14 minutes ago, Joe said:

...that's my point. If Jones is given the opportunities Kamara has had, he's probably the more productive back.

 

because we haven't exactly seen it. Kamara has had the benefit of being in one offense his entire career. Jones has been given a more challenging hand than Kamara.

Tough to get those opportunities when you are injured, have suspect pass protection skills and have dropped a few easy passes on screens.

I get the love for Jones, but the notion that he's on par with Kamara is not one that I cannot buy into.

[vegas492]

7 minutes ago, Shanedorf said:

Teams talk to the Refs before every game, tell them what to look for. That's likely why Kenny Clark got the defensive holding call early on vs the bears
The bears told the refs to keep an eye out for it

IF the Packers OL were actually holding, the opponents and refs would do something about it. What it comes down to is that dork fans don't understand the intricacies of NFL blocking, but assume they do.

You and I both know that you can call holding on most every play.

I don't know if the "hug" is holding.  Seems to me like in the Bulaga cut ups, he's square to the opponent.  Typical holding is called when a guy is going by an offensive lineman and there is hook and/or take down.  Or a jersey grab that takes away momentum.

In this case?  The "hug" case?  He's giving up his chest in order to neutralize those hands.  And he's a dancing bear with those feet while doing that.

that whole giving up of the chest means a bull rush can counter the "hug" and we've seen our guys struggle with the bull rush at time.  

I'm not sure it is holding.  If the defender gets under and ultimately around?  And that shoulder is exposed with a jersey grab?  That's the one that I think can and will be called.

But square up on a guy?  Seems like great technique to me.  

I doubt that GB does it on every play.  I don't doubt that it is a taught technique and busted out when the lineman sees where those hands are going.

It's just an interesting topic to me.  Thanks for participating!  Probably going to send it to my old man and see what the ole line coach thinks.

[HighCalebR]

2 minutes ago, vegas492 said:

Tough to get those opportunities when you are injured, have suspect pass protection skills and have dropped a few easy passes on screens.

I get the love for Jones, but the notion that he's on par with Kamara is not one that I cannot buy into.

Yeah Kamara is a rich mans Jones. In that he works in the passing game.

[{Family Ghost}]

I really expected to see more of Aaron Jones in the pass game against the Bears .. hope we start to see what this offense is really supposed to look like in the next few weeks.  Based off of what I saw this past week it still looked the same "Aaron Rodgers holds the ball too long and passes up check-down options, and then gets sacked", offense.

[Joe]

Again, all echoing my point. Jones may not be the best in pass-pro, I'll definitely admit that; but put him in that New Orleans offense over his entire career with a far superior strength and conditioning team and he's just as productive as Kamara if not more productive.

[Leader]

7 minutes ago, Joe said:

Again, all echoing my point. Jones may not be the best in pass-pro, I'll definitely admit that; but put him in that New Orleans offense over his entire career with a far superior strength and conditioning team and he's just as productive as Kamara if not more productive.

To my knowledge, Jone's problems have been (mostly?) knee related and not hammy's (and such) - in which case, the strength and conditioning team doesnt come into play.

[CWood21]

58 minutes ago, Joe said:

...that's my point. If Jones is given the opportunities Kamara has had, he's probably the more productive back.

Availability is only partially the issue with Aaron Jones.  Over his career, Aaron Jones has averaged 1.4 receptions per game on 2.2 targets per game.  Alvin Kamara has averaged 5.3 receptions per game on 6.7 targets per game.  So not only has Alvin Kamara proven he's a more durable player, he's shown to be a significantly bigger piece in the passing game.  Last year, Alvin Kamara led the Saints in rushing attempts and 2nd in targets.  I believe Saquon Barkley and Christian McCaffrey were the only other two RBs who had the most rushing attempts for their team AND was a top 2 receiving threat.

[CWood21]

40 minutes ago, Joe said:

Again, all echoing my point. Jones may not be the best in pass-pro, I'll definitely admit that; but put him in that New Orleans offense over his entire career with a far superior strength and conditioning team and he's just as productive as Kamara if not more productive.

Someone can correct me if I'm wrong, but he's had 3 MCL sprains since he entered the league.  Two of which were his right knee.  Those aren't going to be "fixed" or "corrected" by a S&C team.

[Packerraymond]

1 hour ago, Norm said:

Damarious Randall

No no @Norm the guy that busts has to be the one we bring in, not the guy we let go.

[Packerraymond]

1 hour ago, CWood21 said:

No.  I'm arguing if you're going to use hindsight to justify Cook over Bennett, than you have to use that same hindsight to justify draft picks over Josh Jonest, etc.  Cook fits our offense more maybe 3-4 years after his initial year in Green Bay.  Not having JJSS or Alvin Kamara means we're still working on those positions.  If we had drafted Alvin Kamara instead of Josh Jones, would we even be talking about looking to improve our RB position?  Probably not.  We'd be talking about how we have the position set for the next decade.

Unless you were pounding the table for that particular guy at the time of the pick, I don't think you get the right to use that hindsight a GM for not taking that player. I wanted Brian Burns at 12, if Burns turns out to be a stud, I have a point. If it's Sweat that becomes the star instead of Gary or Burns, what right do I have to call it a blunder when I made the same one? Kamara and JJSS we're brought up here every so often, they were nowhere near draft crushes, no one was screaming for them in that 2nd round. Why do we all of a sudden now just get to say "they should've been the pick?" That's not my style. Add in the fact that it's the 2nd and 3rd round of the draft and you could literally make this argument every single year, I think you're trying to force an apples to oranges comparison.

Cook on the other hand, literally everyone on this forum when asked who was the most important guy to bring back after the ATL game was saying Cook. Everyone was upset when the news broke we weren't re-signing him. There was cautious optimism when we signed Bennett we had replaced or improved but it was quickly apparent we hadn't. Whether it was Ted or Ball who screwed it up, they definitely screwed us.

[CWood21]

6 minutes ago, Packerraymond said:

Unless you were pounding the table for that particular guy at the time of the pick, I don't think you get the right to use that hindsight a GM for not taking that player. I wanted Brian Burns at 12, if Burns turns out to be a stud, I have a point. If it's Sweat that becomes the star instead of Gary or Burns, what right do I have to call it a blunder when I made the same one? Kamara and JJSS we're brought up here every so often, they were nowhere near draft crushes, no one was screaming for them in that 2nd round. Why do we all of a sudden now just get to say "they should've been the pick?" That's not my style. Add in the fact that it's the 2nd and 3rd round of the draft and you could literally make this argument every single year, I think you're trying to force an apples to oranges comparison.

Cook on the other hand, literally everyone on this forum when asked who was the most important guy to bring back after the ATL game was saying Cook. Everyone was upset when the news broke we weren't re-signing him. There was cautious optimism when we signed Bennett we had replaced or improved but it was quickly apparent we hadn't. Whether it was Ted or Ball who screwed it up, they definitely screwed us.

Who was pounding the table for Jared Cook over Martellus Bennett?  Looking back at that thread, both you and incog seem to lack an opinion one way or the other.  But if we weren't pounding the table for JJSS or Kamara, why shouldn't that be applied to this argument as well?  I don't think anyone pounded the table for Jared Cook.  Especially after the details of the contract were leaked, the general consensus was viewed as a steal.

[Packerraymond]

37 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

Who was pounding the table for Jared Cook over Martellus Bennett?  Looking back at that thread, both you and incog seem to lack an opinion one way or the other.  But if we weren't pounding the table for JJSS or Kamara, why shouldn't that be applied to this argument as well?  I don't think anyone pounded the table for Jared Cook.  Especially after the details of the contract were leaked, the general consensus was viewed as a steal.

Everyone was pounding the table for Cook when the season ended. Who here wasn't?