Game of Thrones - Our Watch has Ended

[MacReady]

Just now, ramssuperbowl99 said:

Right next to each other. This is rich.

What in the hell are you trying to say?  You literally said that women are watching the show for the interpreter.  I called you out on it saying that no women are watching the show exclusively for her.  How is that speaking for women?  You're going to tell me that women picked up and started watching this show for a character that wasn't introduced until the second or third season?

Seriously, you're being a ****.  Call me out for disliking Greyworm all you want, but quit with the nonsense suggesting I'm speaking for women.  If I was, you did the exact same damn thing first.  So put that in your pipe and smoke it. 

Jesus. 

[skywindO2]

These threads were so much better when we argued about what is and isn't a book spoiler. 

[ramssuperbowl99]

1 minute ago, HorizontoZenith said:

What in the hell are you trying to say?  You literally said that women are watching the show for the interpreter.  I called you out on it saying that no women are watching the show exclusively for her.  How is that speaking for women?  You're going to tell me that women picked up and started watching this show for a character that wasn't introduced until the second or third season?

Seriously, you're being a ****.  Call me out for disliking Greyworm all you want, but quit with the nonsense suggesting I'm speaking for women.  If I was, you did the exact same damn thing first.  So put that in your pipe and smoke it. 

Jesus. 

Go dig up quotes where I said why women watch this show. I didn't say anything like that, because I don't know why they do. Mostly because I'm a dude.

Spoiler alert: You also don't know why women start watching the show, keep watching the show, or recommend the show unless you've got some polling data to back it up.

You're welcome to have your opinion. You're welcome to argue for it. But acting like you're coming from an objective point of view on this,, speaking for the entirety of the thread, or speaking for the entirely of demographics that you may or may not belong to is going to open you to criticism. And asserting stuff like "this scene is pointless" when there's clear meaning to it that you just happen to not find entertaining or a faithful interpretation of GRRM's books is silly.

[Adrenaline_Flux]

Okay, let's tone this back a bit and stay away from the personal attacks.

[ramssuperbowl99]

2 minutes ago, Adrenaline_Flux said:

Okay, let's tone this back a bit and stay away from the personal attacks.

*opens the moon door*

[Adrenaline_Flux]

Just now, ramssuperbowl99 said:

*opens the moon door*

hold the (moon) door

[MacReady]

Just now, ramssuperbowl99 said:

Go dig up quotes where I said why women watch this show. I didn't say anything like that, because I don't know why they do. Mostly because I'm a dude.

You're right, that was Tatupu who said that, and I responded to him saying that the show needed the interpreter because that's a character that women like.  I responded saying that there are plenty of better characters than Missandei. 

But my overall mood is justified.  Somebody like me expresses an opinion.  Strong dislike for a character.  Everybody jumps on it and there's a hive mind mentality where everybody's like, "Lol, this idiot hates a character, let's all make fun of him."  A person like me defends his stance for disliking a character, and then it devolves into, "Let's make him look like an arse."  It inevitably gets to a point, as you proved, where they start insulting that person's personality.

Lol, he's trying to speak for women.  This guy's a sexist.

I'm just sick of it.  This site wants more discussion, more activity, more opinions.  Granted, the site wants it in football discussion, but the same applies there.  As soon as somebody comes in with a different opinion, and one they do a lot of work to back up, all the old hands jump in like flies on poop to criticize and ridicule the person who has a different opinion, and it inevitably leads to pointing out perceived or completely made up character faults.

You suggested I was trying to speak for women when I simply pointed out that there are plenty of better strong female leads than the friggin interpreter.  And there are.  But somehow that's me trying to speak for women?

You've been emboldened by everybody jumping on and attacking me since I dislike Greyworm.  I've expressed plenty of reasons for why I dislike him, and plenty of reasons to show that he's probably getting more screen time than a character like him needs, and then it devolved into you pulling that crap.

It's obnoxious, and I'm gonna say it right now... You want this site to get more discussion, more activity, more people posting... Quit enabling this kind of behavior where everybody singles out the one person with a different point of view. 

This exact same process of:

Hot take opinion.

That's a stupid opinion because it's not widely held.

Everybody make fun of the guy who had a different opinion

Is what leads to people disappearing from this site and no new people posting on this site.

So how about the next time I say I don't like a character, how about the next time ANYBODY says they don't like a character, you accept that they don't like the character and quit insinuating they're trying to "speak for women."  How about that?

Edited July 24, 2017 by HorizontoZenith

[Adrenaline_Flux]

@HorizontoZenith I haven't seen anyone personally attacking you. If you have had any private messages of that nature, let me know and I will talk to one of the Entertainment or Global moderators.

[MacReady]

Just now, Adrenaline_Flux said:

@HorizontoZenith I haven't seen anyone personally attacking you. If you have had any private messages of that nature, let me know and I will talk to one of the Entertainment or Global moderators.

It's not personal attacks, it's that it always devolves into, "You're sexist, you're racist, you're this because you don't like a character."  Undertones are made of the tiniest comments in a much larger discussion, and then those are brought out and into the open as full fledged accusations and it's childish antics at best.

It just ticked me off that he tried to suggest I was trying to speak for women.  It's the same kind of crap that happened when people didn't like Skyler in Breaking Bad.  It's laughably bad to suggest that women tune into this show for Missandei alone, but somehow me pointing that out is trying to speak for women?

And his response, too.  "Quit trying to suggest everybody thinks the same way you do."  I never said that.  I said that the majority of people who watch Game of Thrones care more about one of thirty other characters, so why spend so much time on Greyworm? 

This kind of thing always leads to absolutes when we're not dealing in absolutes.  Saying, "A lot of people care less about Greyworm than most of the other characters," suddenly turns into, "You said nobody cares about Greyworm."  Yeah, I probably literally said nobody cares about Greyworm, but it's hyperbolic, not literal. 

Compared to other characters, very few people do care about Greyworm, and I used that to suggest why I was upset and bothered by the show making me sit through 7 minutes between two characters I don't care about.  That gets turned into all these accusations and insinuations and it always devolves when it really should be about, "Yeah, I could see why somebody who dislikes Greyworm would be upset about the attention shown to him when there are so many better characters that could use more screen time." 

The whole thing is obnoxious. 

[fretgod99]

I really don't understand how people don't realize how pivotal his character is going to be in the immediate future. It's narrative SOP. If you've watched the show and really paid attention, you should be able to pick up on where exactly they're planning on taking his character. Positions of trust are meant to be abused. It's a cinematic trope that characters like this are going to be the first to heel turn. In retrospect, it'll be blatantly obvious what's being set up. Complaining about devoting time to the development of a plot you don't have sufficient information to understand is bonkers. With all the moving pieces in play, not nearly enough time can always be given to where it always needs to be in order to make apparent to the casual audience what is abundantly clear to the focused viewer. If you're having difficulty sussing out the narrative merit of a particular through-line, I suggest you go back and review all the interactions in question. As you've noted, it shouldn't take long since not a whole lot of time was devoted to the thread (which again, is part of the point - plot twist, homes). Let it build, recognize the brilliance that went into setting this up, and let your anger fade away. It'll all make sense in due time. You'll feel a bit silly after figuring it out, no doubt. Hell, you don't even need to have read the books or scene much of the show to be able to figure out what's going on here. Just watch what happens.

[Adrenaline_Flux]

6 minutes ago, HorizontoZenith said:

It's not personal attacks, it's that it always devolves into, "You're sexist, you're racist, you're this because you don't like a character."  Undertones are made of the tiniest comments in a much larger discussion, and then those are brought out and into the open as full fledged accusations and it's childish antics at best.

It just ticked me off that he tried to suggest I was trying to speak for women.  It's the same kind of crap that happened when people didn't like Skyler in Breaking Bad.  It's laughably bad to suggest that women tune into this show for Missandei alone, but somehow me pointing that out is trying to speak for women?

And his response, too.  "Quit trying to suggest everybody thinks the same way you do."  I never said that.  I said that the majority of people who watch Game of Thrones care more about one of thirty other characters, so why spend so much time on Greyworm? 

This kind of thing always leads to absolutes when we're not dealing in absolutes.  Saying, "A lot of people care less about Greyworm than most of the other characters," suddenly turns into, "You said nobody cares about Greyworm."  Yeah, I probably literally said nobody cares about Greyworm, but it's hyperbolic, not literal. 

Compared to other characters, very few people do care about Greyworm, and I used that to suggest why I was upset and bothered by the show making me sit through 7 minutes between two characters I don't care about.  That gets turned into all these accusations and insinuations and it always devolves when it really should be about, "Yeah, I could see why somebody who dislikes Greyworm would be upset about the attention shown to him when there are so many better characters that could use more screen time." 

The whole thing is obnoxious. 

I don't think he, or anyone, was insinuating that you are sexist or anything like that. 

[skywlker32]

This whole argument is just too much, I would love to see the total time of Greyworm-centric scenes in the series (probably insignificant). One argument was that Dany needed more screen time, but characters like Greyworm were essentially her sounding board to this point. Also of note, HE IS PART OF HER SMALL COUNCIL. Him and Missandei have enough of Dany's trust that they are on the small council. They aren't "just a translator and a soldier."

[MightyMouse07]

Can we stop talking about this nonsense and just enjoy that next week Jon and Dany are finally going to meet. 

[MacReady]

Just now, fretgod99 said:

I really don't understand how people don't realize how pivotal his character is going to be in the immediate future.

If I'm wrong, I'll have a whole lot of crow to eat.  But I doubt you're right.  I see no betrayal in him, I see only a fabricated emotional death scene for him. 

[MacReady]

Just now, Adrenaline_Flux said:

I don't think he, or anyone, was insinuating that you are sexist or anything like that. 

I never suggested he called me sexist.  I suggested there was an absurdity in trying to add to the debate, "He's trying to speak for us and women, lol."  Like... What in the eff does that have to do with the debate?