El Ramster Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 Just now, Breesus mode said: Gurley can be better, and Kamara can almost be as good or better my guy. Also, did you finally get a mic? Dude yes. Are you on now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Breesus mode Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 Just now, El ramster said: Dude yes. Are you on now? Yeah, but I'm installing all my games on an external drive. I'll bump smite up the q tho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Ramster Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 2 minutes ago, Breesus mode said: Yeah, but I'm installing all my games on an external drive. I'll bump smite up the q tho. I should have an hour or 2 to play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Breesus mode Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 (edited) nvm Edited October 4, 2018 by Breesus mode Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SmittyBacall Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 2 hours ago, NoFlyZone said: The lack of Zeke in this thread is interesting. Not sure what else the guy has to do. He’s in like Tier 1B for me. He’s lacking as a receiver in comparison to the top 3. In the modern game that needs to be accounted for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GamedayGuru Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 1 hour ago, Breesus mode said: Yeah, but I'm installing all my games on an external drive. I'll bump smite up the q tho. what are we playing and on what system? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calvert28 Posted October 5, 2018 Share Posted October 5, 2018 2 hours ago, SmittyBacall said: He’s in like Tier 1B for me. He’s lacking as a receiver in comparison to the top 3. In the modern game that needs to be accounted for. This is probably the very worst argument I have heard in this thread. So how do you "account" for the Cowboys actually having a better record when they give Zeke more then 20 carries a game? Not to mention team cant even reach a .500 record without him but it's all about the passing game right? Here's something you can account for, I highly doubt the Saints would miss Kamara nearly as much as the Cowboys miss Zekes rushing attack. And the Saints record is more dependent on Brees passing then Kamaras receiving stats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Ramster Posted October 5, 2018 Share Posted October 5, 2018 1 minute ago, Calvert28 said: This is probably the very worst argument I have heard in this thread. So how do you "account" for the Cowboys actually having a better record when they give Zeke more then 20 carries a game? Not to mention team cant even reach a .500 record without him but it's all about the passing game right? Here's something you can account for, I highly doubt the Saints would miss Kamara nearly as much as the Cowboys miss Zekes rushing attack. And the Saints record is more dependent on Brees passing then Kamaras receiving stats. Yeah but why reward bad teams for being bad? Just like why punish great teams for being great. You’re simply saying our team sucks arse with Zeke, without him we aren’t even a NFL caliber team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SmittyBacall Posted October 5, 2018 Share Posted October 5, 2018 Just now, Calvert28 said: This is probably the very worst argument I have heard in this thread. So how do you "account" for the Cowboys actually having a better record when they give Zeke more then 20 carries a game? Not to mention team cant even reach a .500 record without him but it's all about the passing game right? Here's something you can account for, I highly doubt the Saints would miss Kamara nearly as much as the Cowboys miss Zekes rushing attack. And the Saints record is more dependent on Brees passing then Kamaras receiving stats. A players value to their respective team has nothing to do with my ranking. I base it on the individual. I could care less what Zeke means to the Cowboys or what Kamara means to the Saints. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calvert28 Posted October 5, 2018 Share Posted October 5, 2018 Just now, El ramster said: Yeah but why reward bad teams for being bad? Just like why punish great teams for being great. You’re simply saying our team sucks arse with Zeke, without him we aren’t even a NFL caliber team. ?? I don't get what you're saying, and aren't you a Rams fan? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoFlyZone Posted October 5, 2018 Share Posted October 5, 2018 2 hours ago, SmittyBacall said: He’s in like Tier 1B for me. He’s lacking as a receiver in comparison to the top 3. In the modern game that needs to be accounted for. To what extent, though? Would you take Alvin Kamara over Adrian Peterson in his prime simply because Peterson wasn't really utilized as a receiving threat? I think it's good to evaluate players based on their total skill set, but I think people are getting a little carried away and placing too much weight on how involved a running back is in the passing game. Just because Zeke isn't quite utilized in the same way I don't think it means he should belong on a whole separate tier as a player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrry32 Posted October 5, 2018 Share Posted October 5, 2018 12 hours ago, sammymvpknight said: Cadillac Williams had a monster rookie season before flaming out, mainly because injury. I think that it’s safe to say that it is exceptionally rare for a RB to be as great as Kamara early in his career and not be great for a longer period of time barring injury. Somrthing that I think that gets overlooked is that Kamara is essentially the Antonio Brown of the RB position...his consistency game to game is unparalleled. He is the probably one of top three “match-up” proof players in the NFL at any position on the offensive side of the ball. In order to shut him down your defense can’t have a weakness...otherwise Kamara exploits it. As good as Gurley is...elite run defenses can contain him. I’m pretty sure that if you did a standard deviation of his statistical output, Kamara will probably have one of the most narrow standard deviations on all time...and I’d be shocked if he isn’t currently atop the RB position. What? Elite run defenses can contain any HB in the running game. On 10/2/2018 at 9:26 PM, GamedayGuru said: How about I just say right now Gurley and bell are THE guys because they have been productive and been work horses and played longer but . I’ll also add I believe Kamara has more potential than both. It’s an opinion statement so it can’t really be argued. Good talk everyone. It can definitely be argued. But it's probably not worth the time. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SmittyBacall Posted October 5, 2018 Share Posted October 5, 2018 (edited) 24 minutes ago, NoFlyZone said: To what extent, though? Would you take Alvin Kamara over Adrian Peterson in his prime simply because Peterson wasn't really utilized as a receiving threat? I think it's good to evaluate players based on their total skill set, but I think people are getting a little carried away and placing too much weight on how involved a running back is in the passing game. Just because Zeke isn't quite utilized in the same way I don't think it means he should belong on a whole separate tier as a player. To what extent is a good question. If I were to divide the value of each ability (running, passing) I’d probably put it at a 50/50, maybe 60/40 split of importance. I’d rather have an all-pro runningback that can play 100% of the downs at an elite level - both passing and running situations - than a pure runner that gets spelled by a better receiving back in passing scenarios. Let’s say we rate AP or Zeke as a 10/10 runner. And Kamara - for the sake of this argument - is lesser at 9/10. But Zeke is a 4/10 as a receiver, while Kamara is a 10/10. Based on that, give me Kamara regardless of scheme. He can be as effective as a runner and bring far more additional value as a pass-catcher. Furthermore, Zeke is far more scheme dependent and fulfills his potential on an offense like the Cowboys that utilizes old-school power running system and less spread looks. I didn’t mean to just zero in on Kamara vs. Zeke. They were just used as examples. I should also point out I put Zeke in Tier 1B. Not Tier 2. The gap isn’t monumental by any means. He’s still an elite runningback. I’m just splitting hairs. Edited October 5, 2018 by SmittyBacall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sammymvpknight Posted October 5, 2018 Share Posted October 5, 2018 7 minutes ago, jrry32 said: What? Elite run defenses can contain any HB in the running game. It can definitely be argued. But it's probably not worth the time. That’s my point. Yes...an elite run defense can stop the run but can’t necessarily stop the pass. That was my entire argument...that Kamara is matchup proof and it’s why he has a tiny game to game variance in total production. That was my entire argument...and you missed it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrry32 Posted October 5, 2018 Share Posted October 5, 2018 Just now, sammymvpknight said: That’s my point. Yes...an elite run defense can stop the run but can’t necessarily stop the pass. That was my entire argument...that Kamara is matchup proof and it’s why he has a tiny game to game variance in total production. That was my entire argument...and you missed it. Your entire argument doesn't make sense. Gurley is on his level as a passing-game HB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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