Packerraymond Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 9 hours ago, vegas492 said: Another reason why you don't pay him now. Vic Beasley. I had forgotten about him. Much like the NFL has. Not really comparable IMO. Gary wins with power, that doesn't fade like edge burners. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 9 hours ago, vegas492 said: Another reason why you don't pay him now. Vic Beasley. I had forgotten about him. Much like the NFL has. Pressure win rates invalidate this comparison. Beasley never had sustainable pass rush production. Gary does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wgbeethree Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 9 minutes ago, AlexGreen#20 said: Pressure win rates invalidate this comparison. Beasley never had sustainable pass rush production. Gary does. This. Beasley had a ridiculous sacks:pressures ratio. Gary has an impressive pressures:sacks ratio. You should always bet on the latter. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vegas492 Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 10 hours ago, Packerraymond said: Not really comparable IMO. Gary wins with power, that doesn't fade like edge burners. Comparable for an EDGE who blew up, then became irrelevant. Doesn't matter to me what style the player uses to win. It is.....all about heart. Beasley didn't have it. I didn't think Gary had it either, but after putting in all the time he did and transforming his body, yeah, I now feel like he has heart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vegas492 Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 9 hours ago, AlexGreen#20 said: Pressure win rates invalidate this comparison. Beasley never had sustainable pass rush production. Gary does. 9 hours ago, wgbeethree said: This. Beasley had a ridiculous sacks:pressures ratio. Gary has an impressive pressures:sacks ratio. You should always bet on the latter. Sorry. Didn't know I had to make a general statement. It is not about player comparison. I brought up Beasley as an example of an EDGE who balled out and then was heard from no more. As another reason for why it may not be wise to ink Gary to a long term deal, today, as opposed to waiting it out. The deeper dive is appreciated. And yes, I now dig me some Gary. Kid has worked his tail off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vegas492 Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 18 hours ago, gopackgo972 said: Why pay him at all? Let him go to the highest bidder and draft his replacement. The Packer way. 15 hours ago, incognito_man said: This is actually the complete opposite of the Packer way. Hasn't the "Packer Way" been to pay guys off of their rookie deals to nice contracts that will allow them to hit free agency again around age 29? Pay them that second deal and when year 30 starts coming around, then you have a real decision to make? Seems like that used to be the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatJerkDave Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 35 minutes ago, vegas492 said: Hasn't the "Packer Way" been to pay guys off of their rookie deals to nice contracts that will allow them to hit free agency again around age 29? Pay them that second deal and when year 30 starts coming around, then you have a real decision to make? Seems like that used to be the way. Yes. You have to be a special player to get your third deal from this current Packers regime (TT too). Rodgers, Bakhtiari, Preston Smith, Charles Woodson. Even Davante and Clay Matthews didn't receive their third contract from GB, unless you count Davante's franchise tag. Obviously, low cost, one year deals don't count. We technically paid Chandon Sullivan his 3rd, 4th, and 5th NFL contracts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Packerraymond Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 1 hour ago, vegas492 said: Comparable for an EDGE who blew up, then became irrelevant. Doesn't matter to me what style the player uses to win. It is.....all about heart. Beasley didn't have it. I didn't think Gary had it either, but after putting in all the time he did and transforming his body, yeah, I now feel like he has heart. Power is repeatable, power is consistent. It does matter the style they used to win. Kyler Fackrell had a 10 sack season, Gary doesnt. There's some luck to the pass rush game at times. Beasley was never consistent, just had a stretch where his hurries turned into sacks at an unsustainable rate. Gary is not a Beasley, you don't need to have any inkling of worry about that. He still doesn't have a great counter move, but his bull rush is a 98 mph fastball. You may never be a HOF without a counter move, but you can be a 10 year vet and make damn good money without it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vegas492 Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 25 minutes ago, Packerraymond said: Power is repeatable, power is consistent. It does matter the style they used to win. Kyler Fackrell had a 10 sack season, Gary doesnt. There's some luck to the pass rush game at times. Beasley was never consistent, just had a stretch where his hurries turned into sacks at an unsustainable rate. Gary is not a Beasley, you don't need to have any inkling of worry about that. He still doesn't have a great counter move, but his bull rush is a 98 mph fastball. You may never be a HOF without a counter move, but you can be a 10 year vet and make damn good money without it. Missing the point. I'm not arguing what Gary is versus what Beasley was or what Fackrell was. The only point made was that there are instances where you certainly want to wait and see it for multiples years versus offering an instant extension to an EDGE player who blows up for a year. Recent examples being Chubb and Beasley. Chubb for injuries, Beasley for repeatable production. I have little doubt that Gary will be good and command top dollar. Kid is a worker and he is a great athlete. Also...no reason to extend him now when we have little cap room and ultimately, three more years of possible control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanedorf Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 1 hour ago, Packerraymond said: There's some luck to the pass rush game at times. Absolutely And the harder they work - the luckier they get. How cool is that ? Football fans are always looking for comparables, its how our brains are wired. Pattern recognition is critical to our species survival. But fans often take it too far and "see" patterns that don't actually exist. Especially "negative-result patterns" which are burned deeply into their crania; so they are always on the lookout and they always have a visceral response if they think they see it. Every Spring, draft time is loaded with massive pattern-seeking... as fans, scouts and front offices try to use the past to predict the future. With predictably lousy results Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEagle Posted April 14, 2022 Share Posted April 14, 2022 17 hours ago, vegas492 said: Comparable for an EDGE who blew up, then became irrelevant. Doesn't matter to me what style the player uses to win. It is.....all about heart. Beasley didn't have it. I didn't think Gary had it either, but after putting in all the time he did and transforming his body, yeah, I now feel like he has heart. I don't get the thinking that he didn't have heart. If you watched his games, you saw him working his *** off against double teams in a thankless scheme that had him set things up for others. Statically, the production wasn't there, but it had more to do with circumstances. I don't think transformed is the right word. Yes, he's naturally gotten stronger, but this dude was a physical beast right out of college and he's been a hard worker since day one. I read numerous stories when he came out about how hard he worked. I think a narrative got formed about Gary that was completely unfair. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vegas492 Posted April 14, 2022 Share Posted April 14, 2022 6 hours ago, TheEagle said: I don't get the thinking that he didn't have heart. If you watched his games, you saw him working his *** off against double teams in a thankless scheme that had him set things up for others. Statically, the production wasn't there, but it had more to do with circumstances. I don't think transformed is the right word. Yes, he's naturally gotten stronger, but this dude was a physical beast right out of college and he's been a hard worker since day one. I read numerous stories when he came out about how hard he worked. I think a narrative got formed about Gary that was completely unfair. It may be unfair, but it was my opinion of Gary coming out of college. He was underwhelming to say the least. Add to it him talking about starting an agency before being drafted and I thought the kid was in it for only the money. I didn't see much of a hard worker in college. To me he never got better, never improved himself. And? That opinion has been proven out to be false. 100% false. His body transformation has been impressive to me. When we drafted him he had this huge pumpkin face and a spare tire around his midsection. Spare tire is gone. His face is much skinnier. And his athletic traits are really shining. He's always had power, now he has more quickness too. He's been a very cool kid to watch develop. About the only thing I want him to add now, besides a counter move, if arrogance. I want him being an alpha out there. I want him to know he is unblockable and act like it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHARMON9 Posted April 14, 2022 Share Posted April 14, 2022 l expect 14 sacks from Gary this year. Top 15 defensive player in the league. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rainmaker90 Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 i absolutely love this kid. What a freak. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Guy Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 7 minutes ago, Rainmaker90 said: i absolutely love this kid. What a freak. I'm no expert on hand movement but this video looks like a guy with no real plan. Again, would love somebody with more knowledge of the subject but are his arms supposed to be flailing away like that? I guess I would assume there would be more precise movement when you need to chop down as opposed to all, what appears to be wasted motion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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