Josh Allen is an ELITE QB

[3rivers]

I don't normally get into these QB debates that lead to discussions that often can then be arguments . But in case it hasn't been brought up, hasn't elite been more for QB's that have been good in the playoffs or at least have played at such a level for more of a duration?

Right now Allen has a good pace going, and if he keeps that going and get a few post season wins, it starts to look legit.  If Fitzmagic can fade, others can too I suppose

[ronjon1990]

26 minutes ago, 3rivers said:

I don't normally get into these QB debates that lead to discussions that often can then be arguments . But in case it hasn't been brought up, hasn't elite been more for QB's that have been good in the playoffs or at least have played at such a level for more of a duration?

Right now Allen has a good pace going, and if he keeps that going and get a few post season wins, it starts to look legit.  If Fitzmagic can fade, others can too I suppose

That's the thing, I haven't seen many people say he can't be elite. The major criticism of him has been of the "if he puts it together" variety. He's improved tremendously imo. But to sing one's own praises for Allen's improvement to this point as proof of his status as an elite QB is just obnoxious box score scouting. 

He's big, he can make plays with his arm and legs, he's got a howitzer of a right arm. He has all of the makings of an elite QB. He seems tl have the confidence of his coaches and teammates. But he's nowhere near top 8 in the current league status yet. Compared to his time at Wyoming, he's 100× better, which is saying something considering his mechanics coming out, the situation in Buffalo, and the uncertainty about their HC following his rookie year. It's absolutely night and day, and nobody is arguing about that much. But to say he's elite and thus VanS was correct about him is beyond a stretch. 

It would be one thing if people were routinely calling him a bust in the first place. But to my recollection, the general consensus, even on here, was that he could be special once he figured out the nuances of being an NFL QB. With that being the case, the only gains to be had for arguing that he's already elite on VanS' end is to brag for bragging's sake. It's obnoxious and distasteful, leads to zero critical analysis of Josh Allen's progress, and really just comes across as a way to pretend make up for the countless bad takes he's made and stood by. 

If Josh Allen becomes truly elite, I don't think many people who keep close track of football will be all that surprised. So it's not just a hot take, but a cheap one at that. A good comparison would be someone saying that Marcus Lattimore was going to be elite when the 49ers drafted him in the 4th round and using his 4th round status as justification that it was a sage pick. Literally nobody would've been surprised if he became a top 5 back in the league if that injury hadn't prematurely ended his career. Some may have had reasons to be skeptical, as some have with Allen, but it wouldn't have been a huge case of "Oh man, I was totally wrong, he's really good. Good call, VanS". It would be an eye roll that he hitched his wagon to it in the first place because it's not like the doubters were far and wide. It's just cheap gloating masquerading as wisdom and scouting prowess. 

And that's what attracts the harsh criticisms of his posts and said gloating. 

[blizofoz45]

Right now we've got 10 quarterbacks on pace to throw at least 32 touchdowns this season.

Last season only 2 quarterbacks threw over 32 touchdowns.

 

 

[KhanYouDigIt]

Rams are gonna make him look foolish this week when Ramsey locks down Diggs.

Lets get it @El Ramster

[El Ramster]

1 minute ago, KhanYouDigIt said:

Rams are gonna make him look foolish this week when Ramsey locks down Diggs.

Lets get it @El Ramster

Why are you this way? You know what you’re doing.. I think he’s great. And the bills are a rough and tough team. Specially playing in New York. Praying for no injuries! In Goffs name amen. 

[RUGmen]

36 minutes ago, blizofoz45 said:

Right now we've got 10 quarterbacks on pace to throw at least 32 touchdowns this season.

Last season only 2 quarterbacks threw over 32 touchdowns.

 

 

It’s been two games..

[ET80]

7 hours ago, Chiefs_5627 said:

The WHOLE 2 games?! Daaaaaaang, get that guy a bust in Canton!

[ET80]

1 hour ago, jrry32 said:

Nobody gets called elite because they beat up on bad teams. I'll believe it when I see it over a sustained period against some good or better competition.

[ET80]

45 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said:

That's the thing, I haven't seen many people say he can't be elite. The major criticism of him has been of the "if he puts it together" variety. He's improved tremendously imo. But to sing one's own praises for Allen's improvement to this point as proof of his status as an elite QB is just obnoxious box score scouting. 

He's big, he can make plays with his arm and legs, he's got a howitzer of a right arm. He has all of the makings of an elite QB. He seems tl have the confidence of his coaches and teammates. But he's nowhere near top 8 in the current league status yet. Compared to his time at Wyoming, he's 100× better, which is saying something considering his mechanics coming out, the situation in Buffalo, and the uncertainty about their HC following his rookie year. It's absolutely night and day, and nobody is arguing about that much. But to say he's elite and thus VanS was correct about him is beyond a stretch. 

It would be one thing if people were routinely calling him a bust in the first place. But to my recollection, the general consensus, even on here, was that he could be special once he figured out the nuances of being an NFL QB. With that being the case, the only gains to be had for arguing that he's already elite on VanS' end is to brag for bragging's sake. It's obnoxious and distasteful, leads to zero critical analysis of Josh Allen's progress, and really just comes across as a way to pretend make up for the countless bad takes he's made and stood by. 

If Josh Allen becomes truly elite, I don't think many people who keep close track of football will be all that surprised. So it's not just a hot take, but a cheap one at that. A good comparison would be someone saying that Marcus Lattimore was going to be elite when the 49ers drafted him in the 4th round and using his 4th round status as justification that it was a sage pick. Literally nobody would've been surprised if he became a top 5 back in the league if that injury hadn't prematurely ended his career. Some may have had reasons to be skeptical, as some have with Allen, but it wouldn't have been a huge case of "Oh man, I was totally wrong, he's really good. Good call, VanS". It would be an eye roll that he hitched his wagon to it in the first place because it's not like the doubters were far and wide. It's just cheap gloating masquerading as wisdom and scouting prowess. 

And that's what attracts the harsh criticisms of his posts and said gloating. 

Yeah, this earns it.

[GSUeagles14]

2 hours ago, Ray Reed said:

As an unbiased observer of this whole VanS/Josh Allen saga all summer I’ll say this, and it won’t be popular but w/e

VanS argued all summer that Josh Allen was better than he’s been given credit for so far in his career. A lot of people spent a lot of time arguing against that notion. Josh Allen comes out on fire, and VanS lets people know about it. Just like many people on this site would if they got as much backlash as he got over the summer.

But a lot of people on this site don’t like that VanS guy, for whatever reason, so they’ll continue to fight tooth and nail against Allen’s successes early and often. And they’ll keep arguing semantics and pick and choose certain phrases to argue but the fact of the matter is that Josh Allen looks great, VanS feels vindicated and will do a victory lap so long as Allen keeps playing well, the people that spent their summer arguing him will never want to concede a shred of ground to him because of how dismissive they were of his entire football world view, and no one’s going to budge on any of that. 

It iz what it izzzz

this really wasnt what happened though?

 

i dont think too many, if any at all, have said allen wasnt promising so far in his career. people liked allen going into this year in fact. @VanS has argued hes elite and this year will show it, which then retroactively proves he was elite all along. people diagareed with that logic obviously, aa its horrendously bad. 

 

 

edit.... oops, @ronjon1990 already had a much better explanation of what actually happened.

Edited September 22, 2020 by GSUeagles14

[Trentwannabe]

38 minutes ago, El Ramster said:

Why are you this way? You know what you’re doing.. I think he’s great. And the bills are a rough and tough team. Specially playing in New York. Praying for no injuries! In Goffs name amen. 

Seconded.

[ronjon1990]

11 minutes ago, GSUeagles14 said:

@ronjon1990 already had a much better explanation of what actually happened.

Gracias for the shout. 

Also, I must thank ET for the AA. I live for those sublte commendations. 😁😉

[3rivers]

1 hour ago, ronjon1990 said:

It would be one thing if people were routinely calling him a bust in the first place. But to my recollection, the general consensus, even on here, was that he could be special once he figured out the nuances of being an NFL QB. With that being the case, the only gains to be had for arguing that he's already elite on VanS' end is to brag for bragging's sake. It's obnoxious and distasteful, leads to zero critical analysis of Josh Allen's progress, and really just comes across as a way to pretend make up for the countless bad takes he's made and stood by. 

If Josh Allen becomes truly elite, I don't think many people who keep close track of football will be all that surprised. So it's not just a hot take, but a cheap one at that

He has some talent around him and a defence to help. I am not sure of their rushing attack, but that always helps too, well for most.  If he can stay calm, and the key players stay healthy, I can see him having a good season.  The main issue is  getting familiar with coaching scheme/system and teammates. The as time goes on, being nervous and making a mistake as he did in the playoff game probably will be a thing of the past. 

I'm actually hoping he does well, it would be nice if he finally  got the bills a SB seeing he is down to earth. Much different than when kelly was there in the early years after he badmouth buffalo and went to the USF and then threw team-mates under the bus when he got to the bills     👏.  Allen appears to be a leader, and not afraid to run or get hit. Maybe he can survive that but usually it's ill advised due to injuries just waiting to happen.  He's surprisingly quick and difficult to track down and tackle too, not an easy QB to defend I would say.  I think acquiring  Diggs was a good idea too, the FO got a top tier WR. 

[BayRaider]

Allen has far from proven himself as "Elite". He hasn't even fully proved he's not a bust yet, he does miss some easy throws that are just horrendous looking. However, looking unlikely he's a complete bust. I do give credit where credit is due though, Allen is currently my #2 in the MVP Race in my MVP Thread.

Edited September 23, 2020 by BayRaider

[ronjon1990]

Just now, 3rivers said:

I'm actually hoping he does well, it would be nice if he finally  got the bills a SB seeing he is down to earth.

To be 100% fair, I've gone on record I have the Bills winning it all this year. Allen just needs to not go down as another Dilfer/Flacco and he'll be just fine.