2021 NFL Draft Thread

[NCOUGHMAN]

41 minutes ago, jimkelly02 said:

I agree and disagree with your analysis. Stills is incredibly sudden and powerful out of his stance.... very good hands...great motor...very very good hands that are pretty strong.... very nice jab....and he stays low, mainly due to his size and gets his power from that 

but he’s weak on counter moves..... and isn’t great at shedding blocks- he’s good at shooting gaps but he freelances that too much.... he leaves massive running lanes wide open sometimes.   That isn’t gonna fly in the NFL.  The more you free lance and take chances the more likely you are to rack up stats and make big plays.... and equally likely to give up big plays.  So it makes you wonder how many splash plays he’ll be able to make if taking less chances  and playing disciplined within a scheme.

And it’s gonna be a struggle to play the run for him in the nfl.... your description makes it sounds like he’s a run stuffer and Geno Atkins level strong and that isn’t the case at all.

Lol gonna be interesting to see how he turns out. We disagreed about Jefferson the wr last draft too

[jimkelly02]

14 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

In a dream scenario, I'd give Leonard Williams a big deal in free agency, draft Greg Rousseau at #17, and draft Christian Barmore at #48. 

Thats def a dream scenario! I’d love it! Omfg yes!  but pump the breaks on Rosseau and watch a good bit of game taps.! Lots of those 15.5 sacks came from inside rushes.... he’d just loop from the 1 tech lineup around the G as part of a scheme call that was meant to free him up.

he’s got very very good potential!  Can even be very good vs the run.  But he’s not even close to being a good nfl pass rusher.  He’s exactly what you would expect from a kid whose gotten by on his physical advantages, missed the whole freshman year to injury, and had one crazy production 2nd year. 
 

Besides not being refined in technique, etc ... he also doesn’t have great bend.... he’s not an elite athlete.

He’s a lower risk project IMO.... he’s not likely to contribute or play much his first year.... his game today wouldn’t fly vs NfL OTs.  You really need a good DL coach with him and have to be committed to using him sparingly at first and developing him correctly.  I wouldn’t expect to see any major production from him year 2.... maybe even until towards the end of year 2.  It’ll be a slow process.  “Scouts” are waking up to this ..... the group think bubble has been popped:

you see his body stats and production and big name school and think top 5.  It becomes a consensus.  People don’t question it until someone comes out with a video on it and enough people question if that it’s not taboo to say he’s not too 5.... maybe he’s top 15 ... teams will definitely see there’s risk here due to the need for long term development 

[jimkelly02]

16 minutes ago, NCOUGHMAN said:

Lol gonna be interesting to see how he turns out. We disagreed about Jefferson the wr last draft too

I just want to say I’m scouting these players as if I’m a Raiders scout.... I think about how a player fits our team and scheme and im very Leary of having to heavily develop talent because we’re trash at it.  
He definitely can be very good.  He can develop.  I just don’t love him for us.
I don’t think Jefferson has nearly the same success he had in Minnesota with us.

[jimkelly02]

30 minutes ago, MrOaktown_56 said:

Definitely yes to Ross. Needs a change in scenery.

Yeah. He’s shown he can have big games... just not very often.  If he’s cheap I’d definitely take a chance.

[NYRaider]

18 minutes ago, jimkelly02 said:

Thats def a dream scenario! I’d love it! Omfg yes!  but pump the breaks on Rosseau and watch a good bit of game taps.! Lots of those 15.5 sacks came from inside rushes.... he’d just loop from the 1 tech lineup around the G as part of a scheme call that was meant to free him up.

I'd be happy with Rosseau but thinking about it my dream case scenario would probably be Ojulari, Barmore, and Leonard. 

[MrOaktown_56]

16 minutes ago, jimkelly02 said:

Yeah. He’s shown he can have big games... just not very often.  If he’s cheap I’d definitely take a chance.

I'm very into WR "rehabilitation". Agholor was first. We should try to get another.

[Rich7sena]

I quite like Gregory Rousseau. He has the right stuff to be productive from the edge and has experience rushing from the inside. He seems quite strong and knows how to use his length. Most impressively, he is a great mover at his size. He has the innate ability to flatten his rush and finish at the quarterback. This is something that Ferrell lacks.

[MrOaktown_56]

17 minutes ago, Rich7sena said:

I quite like Gregory Rousseau. He has the right stuff to be productive from the edge and has experience rushing from the inside. He seems quite strong and knows how to use his length. Most impressively, he is a great mover at his size. He has the innate ability to flatten his rush and finish at the quarterback. This is something that Ferrell lacks.

Rousseau has some really good traits. I just prefer the more polished edge rushers. I think I like Ojulari and Phillips the most. Then Paye. Then Rousseau. All are top 20 picks for me rn though. I like all of them. Ossai is somewhere in there too.

[Rolni]

Matt Miller gave us Daviyon Nixon recently in his mock.

Could he be the catalist for an improved DL?

[Rich7sena]

8 hours ago, MrOaktown_56 said:

Rousseau has some really good traits. I just prefer the more polished edge rushers. I think I like Ojulari and Phillips the most. Then Paye. Then Rousseau. All are top 20 picks for me rn though. I like all of them. Ossai is somewhere in there too.

I don't think Rousseau is that unpolished based on what I saw from 2019. Maybe he plays a little high, but he has the fundamentals. For edge rushers, I think athletic traits tends to be more important for a player's ceiling than polish (see Clelin Ferrell). That said, I haven't watched the other players you mentioned.

I am generally not in favor of picking a defensive tackle in the first round. Defensive tackle has traditionally been a position of depth in virtually every draft and first round defensive tackles don't tend to offer much more values to guys taken later in the draft (unless they have special traits). I haven't watched any of the top defensive tackles in this draft, but if they all figure to be mid first rounders, then they're probably not much better than guys who could be had in the second or third.

Also, I think the Raiders would be best off signing starters in free agency. The focus at defensive tackle should always always be run defense first and pass rush second. When Maliek Collins signed, I figured he would be a rotational piece in passing situations. It was clear during his time in Dallas and even at Nebraska that he could not hold up as a run defender. The loss of PJ Hall really hurt the Raiders despite the slander the coaching staff and Mike Mayock spoke about him--he was the team's best interior run defender.

[oakdb36]

Hankins was a better run defender than Hall. Problem is they didn't draft Hall to be only a run defender but he hasn't developed into anything else. I don't know if we missed Hall but it didn't help the Texans as they finished last in the league in run D. I know Hall went on IR but they weren't any better when he was healthy.

[Rich7sena]

27 minutes ago, oakdb36 said:

Hankins was a better run defender than Hall. Problem is they didn't draft Hall to be only a run defender but he hasn't developed into anything else. I don't know if we missed Hall but it didn't help the Texans as they finished last in the league in run D. I know Hall went on IR but they weren't any better when he was healthy.

I disagree. Hankins was a good run defender, but Hall was excellent when it was on the field. Also, it's a misnomer that you just need one run defending nose tackle and the other one is a pass rusher. Both have to be able to stop the run. And even if the team drafted Hall to be more than a run stuffer, he ended up being really good at that. Should the Raiders cut Ferrell because he hasn't been more than an average edge-setting defensive end?

I would have to go back and look at how Hall played on the Texans to make a determination on what he was like this season. From the little I read about him, he seemed to play well. Just because the team defense didn't stop the run doesn't mean he didn't help. Like I said, stopping the run isn't on one player. At the least, you need two defensive tackles that can set the line of scrimmage and the Raiders only had one on the entire roster this season.

[Jerry]

14 hours ago, jimkelly02 said:

waddle with Ruggs would be awesome.

but too rich for our blood!  Can’t afford to spend a first on a WR outside of Chase.... at that point he’s too much of a bargain, but it’d never happen.....

I know it sounds crazy but would any of you want to sign John Ross?  I think it’s be awesome to have two 4.2 guys.

We just let Rico Gafford walk.  I think we'll be okay.  Agholor is fast fast.

[jimkelly02]

On 1/8/2021 at 9:33 AM, Rich7sena said:

I don't think Rousseau is that unpolished based on what I saw from 2019. Maybe he plays a little high, but he has the fundamentals. For edge rushers, I think athletic traits tends to be more important for a player's ceiling than polish (see Clelin Ferrell). That said, I haven't watched the other players you mentioned.

I am generally not in favor of picking a defensive tackle in the first round. Defensive tackle has traditionally been a position of depth in virtually every draft and first round defensive tackles don't tend to offer much more values to guys taken later in the draft (unless they have special traits). I haven't watched any of the top defensive tackles in this draft, but if they all figure to be mid first rounders, then they're probably not much better than guys who could be had in the second or third.

Also, I think the Raiders would be best off signing starters in free agency. The focus at defensive tackle should always always be run defense first and pass rush second. When Maliek Collins signed, I figured he would be a rotational piece in passing situations. It was clear during his time in Dallas and even at Nebraska that he could not hold up as a run defender. The loss of PJ Hall really hurt the Raiders despite the slander the coaching staff and Mike Mayock spoke about him--he was the team's best interior run defender.

yes!  hall was a pretty good run defender from the 3T alongside Hankins.  When he got cut I warned everyone many times over we'd really miss his run Defense.  i was livid when Hall was cut cuz i knew our run D would massively suffer.  he didnt run up the stat sheet, but hall was very active as a run defender and was what i call "an active run defender".... he'd pursue plays down the line.... which closes gaps and running lanes even if he doesnt get the tackle.  hankins and hall where a pretty good combo.

id really like to sign hankins back.  he wont be that expensive.  if your looking to upgrade then dalvin tomlinson is the guy, but he'll be expensive.  either way we still need to add a length 3T whose good versus the run.

Edited January 9, 2021 by jimkelly02

[Humble_Beast]

That Notre Dame LB is starting to grow on me. Seems like he has star potential, still leaning on Phillips...