GDT: Steelers (5-0) at Titans (5-0)

[-Hope-]

3 minutes ago, Airness McNairness said:

I can't disagree with this more... did you not watch any of our playoff games last year? those performances alone dispute with you say. an effective running game contributes to a team win. time of possession, rest for the defense, wearing out the other teams d, etc.

the entire rationale is that the patriots played us like this in the playoffs and limited us to 14 points on offense. the only reason they lost was because our defense played a great game. if we get limited to 14 points on sunday....we ain't winning lol

[TitanSS]

2 hours ago, titanrick said:

I tend to agree, but the problem with that approach is you take away one or even two entire possessions from your own offense.  If Henry is rolling, we're chewing up clock and dominating TOP.

TOP is often over-emphasized in my opinion. I see it as a by-product of a successful offense, not something a successful offense should try to maximize if that makes sense.

With the way our offense is playing shortening the game by a couple possessions would be a good thing for opposing defenses. 

Henry's averaged over 4 YPC once this season and our team is averaging over 30 PPG. Stopping Henry isn't stopping us from scoring points. I'd take the Patriots approach in the playoffs.

[TitanSS]

24 minutes ago, Airness McNairness said:

I can't disagree with this more... did you not watch any of our playoff games last year? those performances alone dispute with you say. an effective running game contributes to a team win. time of possession, rest for the defense, wearing out the other teams d, etc.

Yes. Derrick Henry went off to the tune of 14 points against the Patriots. 

Our running game looked great but it's difficult to score a lot of points just running the ball, which is the goal of every offense. Maximize points scored. 

No one ever said it doesn't contribute to a win, of course it does. But if I have to choose between getting destroyed through the air at 9 yards per play or on the ground at 5 yards per play it's pretty hard to argue with math.

[TitanTuff]

"They've got DOODS." ~JROB

 

[TitanSlim]

As disappointing as our 2020 draft class has been, our 2019 class looks like a special group. 

[TitanSS]

We should send our first round pick to the Jets for Quinnen Williams. He's better than anyone we'd be able to get with the 32nd pick next year.

[TitanTuff]

2 hours ago, TitanSlim said:

As disappointing as our 2020 draft class has been, our 2019 class looks like a special group. 

At the very end of Henry's TD run, he was clocked at  21mph and the defenders can't catch up. Now look at #11 coming in on the left side. He closes faster than the defense. lol look how far away he starts from when he eventually finishes. That is a fast man.

[KingTitan]

2 hours ago, TitanSlim said:

As disappointing as our 2020 draft class has been, our 2019 class looks like a special group. 

3 Starters and two of those are potential All-Pro level talents. (Simmons, Brown) along with Davis.
Robinson killed it with that one.

2020 doesn't give me that same vibe..lol Wilson might be cut next year. 

[titans0021]

57 minutes ago, TitanTuff said:

At the very end of Henry's TD run, he was clocked at  21mph and the defenders can't catch up. Now look at #11 coming in on the left side. He closes faster than the defense. lol look how far away he starts from when he eventually finishes. That is a fast man.

Yeah, I think I mentioned that in the Texans GDT. AJ was blocking on the right at about the 15 at the start of the run. 85 yards, all the way across the field.

[TitanLegend]

43 minutes ago, titans0021 said:

Yeah, I think I mentioned that in the Texans GDT. AJ was blocking on the right at about the 15 at the start of the run. 85 yards, all the way across the field.

Corey Davis has taught him well.

[twotonebluenation]

12 hours ago, TitanSlim said:

As disappointing as our 2020 draft class has been, our 2019 class looks like a special group. 

Davis has jumped out to me every week with a special block. 

[twotonebluenation]

11 hours ago, TitanSS said:

We should send our first round pick to the Jets for Quinnen Williams. He's better than anyone we'd be able to get with the 32nd pick next year.

I like the way you are thinking.😉

[Steeler Hitman]

19 hours ago, Mesa_Titan said:

Doesn't mean he's not your best corner.

I wouldn't lie to you and I am not trying to bs you or anyone else here. I have been watching Steelers football since 1970. I certainly am not going to argue that point if you believe otherwise as a Titans fan. I stand behind what I say completely as a Steelers fan of 50 years and someone who has watched, studied, and critiqued a whole lot of Steelers football over the years. I can remember our teams rivalry as far back as the Houston Oilers days.  I am just sharing my opinion with your group.

I love Mike Hilton, but he isn't Joe Haden or Steve Nelson at CB on his best days covering. Hitting, tackling, and blitzing, he is very good in that role.  I respect what you and what most of Titans Nation says about your team because some of you have watched, studied, and objectively critiqued your team and players for years as I do my team. I watch other games, but not more than I do my team. I am here to share some honest insight and evaluations of the Steelers as it relates to our game versus the Titans. We will respectfully agree to disagree on Hilton being the Steelers best CB.

Logan Ryan played the nickel exclusively here. He was our best corner.

I am not disagreeing that a slot cannot be a teams the best CB, but that argument still doesn't make Mike Hilton the Steelers best CB. Deion Sanders played Nickel, Dime, and some slot late in his career and he was still the best cover guy on those Washington and Baltimore teams. Mike Hilton isn't Prime Time, Logan Ryan, Steve Nelson, or Joe Haden.  He is a solid role player who is being used to do specialty things in the Steelers defensive scheme. If you don't believe me, watch some coaches all 22 on the Steelers defense and then objectively tell me Mike Hilton is a better all around CB on the Steelers than Haden and Nelson. If Haden or Nelson were to go down, see who the Steelers replace them with. I would be shocked 😨 if it were Hilton. In the past it wasn't either. Opposing offenses and WR's would lick their chops. That's just not Hilton's best role (outside).

[quiller]

The debate on running game doesn't matter and TOP is  hot and long debate on these boards. I go over it on other teams threads regularly as well. 

My take on the debate is fairly simple. I feel the key to a winning team is executing plays and controlling the LOS period stop.

TOP can help some teams more then others.  In terms of the Titans the presence of Henry and our OL has two key factors. Through three quarters the threat of running Henry helps our pass offense in play action and just straight early down passing. The key part of Henry and the TOP aspect though is late in the game. With Henry late in a game when we have the lead we can then shorten the game. This means we can get the ball with 5-6 minutes left use most if not all of that clock and play keep away. And if we are with in a FG even ultimately kick a game winning FG and not give the other team the ball back. That is  a huge advantage.   Also like our last game late in the game or Over time defenses can be worn down trying to tackle Henry all the game. This gets magnified if they have a quick strike offense and don't give their defense rest.   This also means as the game goes on our defense is getting more rest and might be more effective when it comes out late in games. 

[Steeler Hitman]

20 hours ago, Airness McNairness said:

I can't disagree with this more... did you not watch any of our playoff games last year? those performances alone dispute with you say. an effective running game contributes to a team win. time of possession, rest for the defense, wearing out the other teams d, etc.

I agree Airness McNairness. The Steelers do not want Derrick Henry running all over the defense and limiting our offense. The Titans scored over 40 points and 500+ yards on offense. That is exceptional offensive football.  I think the Steelers have a better chance of a win if Henry doesn't run wild. The Titans proved they can pass as well. I think the Steelers can survive 300 yards passing in this day and age of offensive football than 200 yards rushing. Of course, we would prefer to keep you in the 250-300 total yard for the range or less. 

19 hours ago, TitanSS said:

TOP is often over-emphasized in my opinion. I see it as a by-product of a successful offense, not something a successful offense should try to maximize if that makes sense.

That is philosophy and I respect your difference. I disagree especially in the play-offs as if you build a lead, can limit opponents offensive touches, hold onto the football and score, you greatly increase your chances to win. 

With the way our offense is playing shortening the game by a couple possessions would be a good thing for opposing defenses. 

 No doubt that is exactly what your opponents are trying to do. Less possessions, typically mean less offensive scoring chances. If I can get the Titans in three and outs and hold onto the ball and score a few TD's, yeah I would take being up 17-0 near the end of the second quarter giving you only four possessions to score. If you are scoring every possession then yes, your opponent is going to have to shoot it out with you.  That was last weeks game. It could have been different if they could have stopped Henry's 200+ rushing yards and 90+ yard TD run. 

Henry's averaged over 4 YPC once this season and our team is averaging over 30 PPG. Stopping Henry isn't stopping us from scoring points. I'd take the Patriots approach in the playoffs.

If the Steelers stop Henry the they are winning at the LOS. I like our chances. If we don't win up front, Henry will run wild and I don't like our chances. It is not just Henry's YPC avg, it is the consistency to allow him to run.  It keeps your offense from being one dimensional it opens up play action and other passing options out of run stopping defenses, etc.  It is the threat of the run. Cleveland did this masterfully against Dallas to the tune of 300+ yards rushing.

19 hours ago, TitanSS said:

Yes. Derrick Henry went off to the tune of 14 points against the Patriots. 

He allowed your passing game to be effective. The threat of the run set up the pass that game and against Baltimore.

Our running game looked great but it's difficult to score a lot of points just running the ball, which is the goal of every offense. Maximize points scored. 

Balanced football makes most offenses dangerous. If Connor and company can run well  it will open the Steelers offense up as well. I am not suggesting to be a one-dimensional running team. Just stating that 50/50 or 60/40 pass/run is harder to defend than going one dimensional.

No one ever said it doesn't contribute to a win, of course it does. But if I have to choose between getting destroyed through the air at 9 yards per play or on the ground at 5 yards per play it's pretty hard to argue with math.

If that happens you are losing either way. Too much yardage and first downs given up. Only hope is if they can't put the ball in the endzone or they turn the ball over. Only other way is if your offense can keep up with the scoring and hopefully get the ball last. If a team can run at 5 yards a clip, they are wearing your defense down. If they are hitting you at 9 yards a pass completion, they are moving the chains as well. You've got some serious defensive issues either way and most likely will lose unless they start turning the ball over and or you can score with them. A few years ago the Steelers lost to Denver after putting up over 400 yards of offense. The problem is they didn't score enough TD's and turned the ball over. Ben threw a 90 yard + TD pass to Ju Ju. The problem was the turnovers and couple that with the fact that Phillip Lindsey ran for over 100 yards and limited the Steelers opportunities to get the ball back.  The Bronco's running attack did our team in as much as we beat ourselves. That's all I am saying. I've seen it with this Steelers team.  They have worked hard to try to fix the weak run defense of those years.