oakdb36 Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 Just now, NCOUGHMAN said: To me it goes average-good-great-elite. I think we’re good pushing towards great so I’m guessing you say we’re great pushing towards elite. imo it’s hard to be an elite offense without elite players only one maybe Worth arguing for elite Status is waller and we all know how I feel about him. Trent would be next if he wasn’t a fat slob who is always hurt. Other than that I don’t see any elite players on offense I don't really disagree with your assessment although i'd put Hudson in the elite category and Jacobs pretty close too. I think the offense is performing above its talent level and one more reason why i don't understand the lofty expectations some seem to have for it. I think it played as well as it could with a non elite QB, Agholor as the main WR and 2/5 of the starting oline out for most of the season. When you look at offensive rosters around the league, the Raiders aren't in the top 5, probably not in the top 10. The WRs are probably outside the top half. There's upside there though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucksavage1 Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 27 minutes ago, oakdb36 said: I didn't say it was elite either. I posted stats because @Totty asked for facts. It's borderline elite. Offensive stats can be padded at the end of games. The eye test shows he have a good offense that has room for improvement. Look at Tampa Last year compared to this year 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakdb36 Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 Where did the ignore feature go? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BackinBlack Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 Trent Brown - 21.5 Mil Mariota - 9 Mil Witten - 4.75 Tyrell Williams - 11.1 Mil Richie - 6.75 Mil - there is 53.1 mil, more than 25% of our Salary cap for the season, that played what like 5 games? You want to improve our team, fix this. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 25 minutes ago, NCOUGHMAN said: To me it goes average-good-great-elite. I think we’re good pushing towards great so I’m guessing you say we’re great pushing towards elite. imo it’s hard to be an elite offense without elite players only one maybe Worth arguing for elite Status is waller and we all know how I feel about him. Trent would be next if he wasn’t a fat slob who is always hurt. Other than that I don’t see any elite players on offense It's pretty easy for us to become great-elite with what we currently have on roster. 2nd year RB, 2nd year WR, two rookie WRs, RT on IR all season, LG on IR all season. replace two starting OL and let our young offensive players develop and all of a sudden we go from 10th to scoring into the top 5-8 next year. I consider top 6-8 great, top 1-5 elite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 10 minutes ago, BackinBlack said: Trent Brown - 21.5 Mil Mariota - 9 Mil Witten - 4.75 Tyrell Williams - 11.1 Mil Richie - 6.75 Mil - there is 53.1 mil, more than 25% of our Salary cap for the season, that played what like 5 games? You want to improve our team, fix this. Replace that with L. Williams, NO's Hendrickson, and a FS and all of a sudden we are rocking and rolling. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BackinBlack Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 5 minutes ago, Jerry said: Replace that with L. Williams, NO's Hendrickson, and a FS and all of a sudden we are rocking and rolling. Haha if only it was that easy. Raiders / Mayock have to get creative with our salary cap and figure out a way to clean it up a bit. I would love Williams, ill be shocked if Giants let him go though. Hendrickson seems like a legit possibility, but could see him get a big contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 Just now, BackinBlack said: Haha if only it was that easy. Raiders / Mayock have to get creative with our salary cap and figure out a way to clean it up a bit. I would love Williams, ill be shocked if Giants let him go though. Hendrickson seems like a legit possibility, but could see him get a big contract. Completely agree. Always easier said than done. I just know we can find some talent in FA and just need to hit on it at 2-3 positions and we can become a much more competitive team overnight. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totty Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 55 minutes ago, oakdb36 said: I didn't say it was elite either. I posted stats because @Totty asked for facts. It's borderline elite. I'm not trying to argue. I just don't see elite. Not number one in any category. Failed drives. Failed games, some of which do fall on the offense. Mostly on Gruden. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BackinBlack Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 6 minutes ago, Jerry said: Completely agree. Always easier said than done. I just know we can find some talent in FA and just need to hit on it at 2-3 positions and we can become a much more competitive team overnight. yup for sure. I think some of our players on D will look a whole lot better if they had real talent next to them. I dont think anyone on our Dline is consistently winning their 1 on 1s, so teams dont need to get creative with blocking schemes. Just block them 1 on 1, and leave a RB to chip if anyone wins. - we add a real talent, someone who demands double teams - all of a sudden Ferrell or Crosby arent drawing a double team. Our LBs - RBs have big lanes and while our lbs are definitely our biggest weakness over the years, no doubt a better line would help them out. Our CBs - show some potential, i really like Mullens, had some rough games down the stretch. But improve the rush and hell improve. Our Safetys - need help here big time. Not giving up on Abrams, but, he is a role playing / near the LOS safety. Need someone who can cover a TE / cover middle of the field. -- Leonard Williams, improves everyone on our D. If he becomes free, we NEED to sign him. Big IF though. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drfrey13 Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 46 minutes ago, oakdb36 said: I didn't say it was elite either. I posted stats because @Totty asked for facts. It's borderline elite. All of the stats point to what most of us here think. We are elite between the 20s but below average in the red zone. This is something I have tried to put my finger on because this could just as easily be a Carr or a Gruden thing but when it matters the team does not produce. We have gone 3-5 the second half of the season every year Carr has been here except 2016 which we were +10 in TO ratio until Cook took over. The only time this team looked like contenders is when we had a +16 TO ratio. Even if the defense duplicated those numbers from 2016 we would still be +4 and ranked 10th with three other teams. The defense needs to pick it up but the offense was also bottom 5 in giveaways. We had multiple games were the defense gave away the game and multiple games that the offense did also. We need to improve on both sides of the ball. We have the potential with a few good signings, draft picks, and luck so am willing to role with Carr another year but if we get a good trade offer I am not against moving on either. 47 minutes ago, BackinBlack said: Everyone says, Carr needs weapons and he doenst elevate anyone. . . Agholor and Waller disagree. Everyone says, Carr needs a top 3 Oline to perform - - not a chance we were close to top 3 this year I do not think Carr elevated Waller. That guy elevated himself by getting his head on straight. How Carr helps him is looking for him because Waller is running free all over the field in between the 20s. His TDs did improve this year but that might be from a lack of options. We know how Agholor gets his TDs but nobody else had more than 2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BackinBlack Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 2 minutes ago, drfrey13 said: I do not think Carr elevated Waller. That guy elevated himself by getting his head on straight. How Carr helps him is looking for him because Waller is running free all over the field in between the 20s. His TDs did improve this year but that might be from a lack of options. We know how Agholor gets his TDs but nobody else had more than 2. haha yea fair enough. Waller is a stud, and IS the focal point of our passing attack. Waller getting clean after becoming a Raider is the greatest thing that happened to our franchise since Bo refused to play for the Bucs 🤣 as much as I hate Carr for his constant pushing of his religious beliefs, Waller has been open in saying that it helped him get his head on straight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geezy Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 1 hour ago, bucksavage1 said: 😂We're 23rd in the NFL in TD redzone % Maybe Elite in Madden and even then a stretch We are a middle of the pack offense literally bad in one stat. it is a big one and im just as frustrated with it as anyone , but you dont think we can make tweaks to improve on that? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 1 hour ago, Jerry said: It's pretty easy for us to become great-elite with what we currently have on roster. 2nd year RB, 2nd year WR, two rookie WRs, RT on IR all season, LG on IR all season. replace two starting OL and let our young offensive players develop and all of a sudden we go from 10th to scoring into the top 5-8 next year. I consider top 6-8 great, top 1-5 elite. I agree. I'm bullish on the offensive talent. Same time, it's not a given. They could regress. Carr wasn't strong the second half of the season. The Oline will see some attrition and we've seen that group struggle some. Then there is the paying calling which 3 years into Gruden still remains conservative and questionable in spots. The red zone offense needs to improve and while it's easy to look at it and say it can be tweaked, they couldn't tweak it in season? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 10 minutes ago, big_palooka said: I agree. I'm bullish on the offensive talent. Same time, it's not a given. They could regress. Carr wasn't strong the second half of the season. The Oline will see some attrition and we've seen that group struggle some. Then there is the paying calling which 3 years into Gruden still remains conservative and questionable in spots. The red zone offense needs to improve and while it's easy to look at it and say it can be tweaked, they couldn't tweak it in season? I agree with the play calling. We've had three and outs at times where we clearly needed to score, but that is football. Hopefully Gruden can look back on this season and realize his play calling at times was too consistent, and that he needs to find ways to get us the TD when we are 1st and goal. I have faith in Gruden. I believe he will continue to improve our offense as a whole, and more specifically, our red zone scoring. I do not think we will regress on offense, especially if we keep Agholor or somehow sign an upgrade (A. Robinson). Only thing that would kill our O is if Jacobs or Waller went down which of course could happen, but we do have pieces on offense that can still help us score (Booker/Moreau). You know, really looking at the bolded sentence, I honestly think our red zone scoring percentage is something that can change in a single season. Improve the running game and all of sudden we can pound it in 9 times out of 10. We clearly couldn't do that this season. Even against the Broncos we had to go for it on fourth and goal. We'll see what happens. I'm optimistic about this upcoming season. If we can see the changes that need to be made, hopefully Gruden and Mayock can see them too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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