Broncos Free Agency Thread

[AKRNA]

4 hours ago, BroncoBruin said:

Original round tender for Lindsay. They’re moving on and I get it, he just doesn’t really fit the offense and is a liability on pass downs. I think we got the best of Lindsay in 2018-2019 and he’ll be a complimentary guy for the rest of his career. 

It's really tough to put a RB on the field in a WCO that can't pass protect. 

[jsthomp2007]

6 hours ago, germ-x said:

Will say, if Denver isn’t bringing back Jackson, no reason to bring back Von. It’s not about competing this year.

Clearly a young team getting even younger.  I hope this all works out because if these guys can mature together, they could dominate for awhile.  But, I think you need some veteran leadership where I think Kareem is perfect in that regard, along with Von.  I'd like to see Von finish his career in Denver, alas I have read that this years group of draft pass rushers is relatively strong, which makes Von expendable.  

[broncos67]

A little surprised about Jackson, but I suppose the combination of Darby, Simmons' new salary, and a desire to get slightly younger in the secondary prompted the move. I liked Kareem a lot. Hopeful he gets one more payday. 

I'd hope we can work something out with Von that's reasonable, but if not, we'll be parting ways. He deserves to land with a contender for a chance at another ring. We're just not there yet.

As for Lindsay, I have a very different perspective than most Broncos fans (certainly a lot of the ones on Twitter, anyway.) I like Lindsay. Love his story and his hustle. But the reality is, he's a 2-down back runner in a 3rd down back body, and he can't catch or block nearly as well as he needs to for maximizing his effectiveness in this offense. It's why Gordon was brought in. No one should be too surprised. I love an underdog story (Chris Harris, anyone?) but it's tough to justify paying Lindsay a ton of money given the nature of the RB position and his skillset.

[Broncofan]

 

Given how the market played out (none of the EDGE's match Von's ceiling, and Von's clean bill of health & his legal issues behind him) - not surprising.   Von had all the leverage.

Now, today's decision doesn't preclude an extension/restructure, or a trade.    Given the direction of the team to go younger, unless we land Watson, a trade is entirely possible.   Guaranteeing 7M doesn't make it any harder to do a trade, or an extension/restructure.  Given the focus to going young, though - a restructure/extension would be surprising at this stage.   But there's nothing that happened today that prevents this.

 

Edited March 16, 2021 by Broncofan

[lomaxgrUK]

7 hours ago, AKRNA said:

It's really tough to put a RB on the field in a WCO that can't pass protect. 

 

32 minutes ago, broncos67 said:

But the reality is, he's a 2-down back runner in a 3rd down back body, and he can't catch or block nearly as well as he needs to for maximizing his effectiveness in this offense.

Exactly this.

I mentioned it an NFL News thread last week - you have to be a brilliant player if you are going to be a RB that can't pass protect or catch the ball out of the backfield. Adrian Peterson (despite his size) was never a good pass protector and useless in the passing game, but he was a HOF runner. Phil isn't Adrian Peterson. 

By the end of last year, Melvin Gordon was showing what is required of an NFL RB. I still hate paying him $8m, however you could see why Elway felt the need to get him because he keeps the Defense guessing. As soon as Phil is in the game, you know it's run and if it isn't, we are playing with 1 less guy basically. You just can't pay $2.5m for that skillset when you have other needs to address.

I am gutted about Kareem leaving. I think our lack of 4 man pass rush let him down last year. He's still a good athlete (especially for his age), but we have to play a ton of two deep against all of our divisional rivals and he just can't run with these young cats without top end pass rush. His attitude was infectious and I bet he's going to be a huge miss in the locker room.

Great that Shelby is back, and with no long term cap implications. 

[jolly red giant]

12 minutes ago, Broncofan said:

 

Given how the market played out (none of the EDGE's match Von's ceiling, and Von's clean bill of health & his legal issues behind him) - not surprising.   Von had all the leverage.

Now, today's decision doesn't preclude an extension/restructure, or a trade.    Given the direction of the team to go younger, unless we land Watson, a trade is entirely possible.   Guaranteeing 7M doesn't make it any harder to do a trade, or an extension/restructure.  Given the focus to going young, though - a restructure/extension would be surprising at this stage.   But there's nothing that happened today that prevents this.

 

I am not surprised with this - always felt that this was the most likely outcome.

The Broncos get to keep Miller for another year, see how he plays after missing last season and then have the option of negotiating with him next year. Now Paton doesn't have to overpay in free agency. Von will be 33 next year, there will be no dead cap money and will likely take a significant pay cut if he wants to stay around.

As has been said - Paton looks like adopting a conservative approach to FA - not overcommitting on anything so soon into the job.

Edited March 16, 2021 by jolly red giant

[Broncofan]

8 minutes ago, jolly red giant said:

I am not surprised with this - always felt that this was the most likely outcome.

The Broncos get to keep Miller for another year, see how he plays after missing last season and then have the option of negotiating with him next year. Now Paton doesn't have to overpay in free agency. von will be 33 next year, there will be no dead cap money and will likely take a significant pay cut if he wants to stay around.

As has been said - Paton looks like adopting a conservative approach to FA - not overcommitting on anything so soon into the job.

The fact that Denver gets nothing if they cut him, probably played a part too.    They play out the string, they should get a decent comp pick in next year's formula - but either way, they get nothing if they let him walk by releasing him when he's under contract. 

Unsurprisingly - the FO did approach Miller about a pay cut - and the camp turned it down, and let the FO decide on keeping him or cutting him.    While ppl will point to the FA deals that ranged between 14-18M - all of them had more years, and thus more guaranteed money.   And none of the guys are at Miller's caliber of play.   So as predicted - with all the leverage, they stood firm - and the FO let the option vest.

Asking Von to take a pay cut given his record when he's under contract - it was never going to fly.   In Miller's mind, he earned that deal.     Next year, when he has to test the open market - different story, Von & his agent will take the market rate for whatever his 2021 level of play dictates.    Of course Miller's age raises doubts for 2021 - but the fact that his injury isn't one with risk of recurrence, and his legal issues were resolved - Miller's camp had all the leverage given Denver would get nothing with a release, and don't have great in-house options (Chubb's still best as the #2 guy, not as the alpha EDGE).   

I wouldn't discount an in-season or a pre-season trade, especially if we don't land the big QB upgrade.   The focus is on going young.   It's just that releasing Von had zero gain, and the gap in contract value was so small, given the return with a release would be only cap savings.

 

Edited March 16, 2021 by Broncofan

[thebestever6]

7 minutes ago, Broncofan said:

wouldn't discount an in-season or a pre-season trade, especially if we don't land the big QB upgrade.   The focus is on going young.   It's just that releasing Von had zero gain, and the gap in contract value was so small, given the return with a release would be only cap savings.

The market may raise vons value tbh. I mean who's left Hendrickson who got mostly coverage sacks just got paid. Hason Reddick a one hit wonder is left and is gonna command a lot more Money than von. 

I wouldn't rule out a trade either cleveland is probably very interested. And we were also very interesting in Leonard Floyd.

[Broncofan]

 

I do like to hear that Paton went young in FA - Darby's 27, and Davis is 26.   While we missed on Davis, this is exactly the upside group of young players to target - not 3rd-4th contract guys.    Paton's direction taken in FA is encouraging so far (nothing too crazy, and not pure stop-gap type signings).  I hate that Kareem wasn't retained heart-wise as a fan, but I do get it, given the age and the wear & tear.   

Edited March 16, 2021 by Broncofan

[lomaxgrUK]

I think I made my feelings very clear through the season about our 4 man pass rush. It simply wasn't there. Reed grew in the season, but I think our fanbase massively overrates him, and definitely overrates Chubb.

This team needs Von. 

[broncos67]

7 minutes ago, Broncofan said:

 

I do like to hear that Paton went young in FA - Darby's 27, and Davis is 26.   While we missed on Davis, this is exactly the upside group of young players to target - not 3rd-4th contract guys.    Paton's direction taken in FA is encouraging so far (nothing too crazy, and not pure stop-gap type signings).  I hate that Kareem wasn't retained heart-wise as a fan, but I do get it, given the age and the wear & tear.   

I said this yesterday, will say it again. We will be bringing in another CB in FA. Despite Klis trying to say our group is solid, it's not, and we need more talent. Darby is a #2, and while he has talent, he also has injury issues. Callahan cant stay healthy. Ojemudia showed flashes, still needs work. Bassey is a UDFA with little experience. Need more talent at the position. Period.

[Broncofan]

33 minutes ago, lomaxgrUK said:

I think I made my feelings very clear through the season about our 4 man pass rush. It simply wasn't there. Reed grew in the season, but I think our fanbase massively overrates him, and definitely overrates Chubb.

This team needs Von. 

To be clear - trading away Von hurts our 2021 chances a ton.   It just may be that Paton is looking at this with the long view lens.   Especially if a team loses a key pass rush guy, Von's value would be a lot higher than it is now.   I wouldn't rule that out.

On the flip side - with a last-place schedule, and playing NYJ/JAX/DET and the NFCE, with even just OK QB play we'd be a 8-9 win team.   With a Watson/Stafford level team we'd easily be 10+ this year.    Either way, the schedule might induce Paton & co. to simple let the string play out, and then let Von walk if he's not worth what the market sets to retain in 2022.    2021 is really going to hinge on whether our O can take a huge step forward.   If it isn't, then trading Von, especially if  his value rises once all the FA EDGE's are gone, is definitely on the radar IMO, either in preseason or in-season.

[BroncoBruin]

Honestly I’m not so sure Ojemudia sticks at corner for the long haul. You can’t have those stretches of poor tackling at safety of course but there are some projectable traits. 

[Broncofan]

13 minutes ago, BroncoBruin said:

Honestly I’m not so sure Ojemudia sticks at corner for the long haul. You can’t have those stretches of poor tackling at safety of course but there are some projectable traits. 

I also wonder if part of the decision behind letting Kareem walk is seeing if Ojemudia plays better at SS.  He has the tools to be a good CB.  But his tackling and nose for the ball in forcing fumbles, SS kinda fits really well too (obv you take the CB if he’s great there - but an OK CB who’s a great tackler and has the speed / size to cover TE’s also makes for a possibly really good safety). 

Edited March 16, 2021 by Broncofan

[AnAngryAmerican]

56 minutes ago, Broncofan said:

 

I do like to hear that Paton went young in FA - Darby's 27, and Davis is 26.   While we missed on Davis, this is exactly the upside group of young players to target - not 3rd-4th contract guys.    Paton's direction taken in FA is encouraging so far (nothing too crazy, and not pure stop-gap type signings).  I hate that Kareem wasn't retained heart-wise as a fan, but I do get it, given the age and the wear & tear.   

Paton has made it pretty clear, at least as clear as a tight-lipped GM does, that his approach in FA will be second contract guys who still a)have upside and b)represent value signings. So far, thats what we’ve done both in retaining our guys and signing Darby. 

Too many fans are short-sighted and don’t understand that Paton is going to play the long game, he’s not going all-in to win a Super Bowl in 2021 because he knows there’s no chance in hell of that happening. 

The team will be cautious but smart this offseason, don’t expect big splashes in either FA or the draft, as this is an evaluator year for the roster and coaching staff. Don’t be surprised to see a trade down in the draft; it’ll be another move that gets panned on the radio and on Twitter but Paton will trust his approach and play the long game.