Jets trade QB Sam Darnold to Carolina

[Greene N White]

1 hour ago, drew39k said:

I'll play.

Option one 

We take Wilson and he is great, Sam sucks in Carolina - Big Win for the Jets

Option two

We take Wilson He sucks and Sam is great - Big Loss for us

Option three:

We take Wilson and he is great, Sam is great in Carolina - Loss for us because we had a QB and could have flipped the value from Wilsons pick to make this team better. We also fail to capitalize on Sam performing well in Carolina because we only got a second and not a conditional second. Because of this the 2nd we get is a late second when it could have been a late first

Option 4 

We Take Wilson He sucks, Sam Sucks in carolina - Loss for us - we would have been better to move down and use the value of pick to to build a team and draft a QB next year with a better team to put him on.

Option 5

We keep Sam - He busts  - Wilson Is great - Loss for us, we managed to get additional draft picks so we can still get a QB next year, and with Sam sucking the pick will likely be high, but we did miss out on a great QB

Option 6

We kept sam he busts- Wilson also busts Win for us. We didn't draft a bust in wilson and were able to get a ton of draft capital for pick 2

Option 7

We keep Sam - He is good, Wilson busts - Huge Win for us - get additional picks on trade down and have a young franchise QB.

There are FAR more likely chances to be successful sticking with Sam than there are by trading him and drafting Wilson. Clearly Joe chose to gamble and the odds are stacked against him that this gamble will payoff. Also, your point about calling this a QB rich draft is pretty invalid. Where were Wilson, Lance and Jones ranked this time last year? This was the Lawrence draft, and maybe Fields would be a 1st round pick Now suddenly Fields is being called the 5th QB to be taken despite ending the this past college season as the expected second best QB. Its all about recency hype. Every year there are QBs that come out of nowhere on the hype train to be "can't miss studs". Wilson is no different than someone like Trubisky in that regard. There will be QBs just like him next year. Hell, look at the draft we got Darnold in. That was the suck for Sam year, then after the season the hype train for Baker pushed him over Darnold in the draft. That draft was also considered"loaded at QB btw, and so far Baker has been questionable at best, only really looking good when cleveland loaded up on skills players(something maybe we should have done?) Rosen being DOA, and Darnold apparently busting here. Allen was properly developed in Buffalo where, once again, they did this crazy thing called getting talent around their young QB to help make the game easier for him...(probably should have done that here huh). Baltimore had success with Jackson too, but it was a gimmicky run first offense that needs to prove it can be sustained at this point(not saying Jackson didn't have a great year) 

 

 

Yeah all these hypothetical situations more often than not keeping Sam is better but you’re forgetting to add 1 key bit of information. Sam darnold is not a good quarterback

[Greene N White]

We can run hypothetical scenarios all day but you are acting like each of those scenarios you listed has equal odds which they don’t. I’d give Sam darnold about a 10% chance of succeeding as an nfl quarterback and I’d say Wilson is 50/50

[drew39k]

47 minutes ago, Greene N White said:

We can run hypothetical scenarios all day but you are acting like each of those scenarios you listed has equal odds which they don’t. I’d give Sam darnold about a 10% chance of succeeding as an nfl quarterback and I’d say Wilson is 50/50

Those are so interesting percentages you are giving lol. Look at the bust rate of 1st round QBs over the past ten years and tell me how you arrived at a 50%rate. Especially considering the additional factors like going to a weak team with a poor qb prep track record and a rookie hc... Wilson's chance of busting is far greater than 50%

 

[drew39k]

56 minutes ago, Greene N White said:

Yeah all these hypothetical situations more often than not keeping Sam is better but you’re forgetting to add 1 key bit of information. Sam darnold is not a good quarterback

Just because you think he isn't a good quarterback doesn't mean he doesn't have the talent to be a good quarterback. Your opinion does not equate to fact.

Edited April 6, 2021 by drew39k

[KimuraGod]

2 hours ago, drew39k said:

I'll play.

Option one 

We take Wilson and he is great, Sam sucks in Carolina - Big Win for the Jets

Option two

We take Wilson He sucks and Sam is great - Big Loss for us

Option three:

We take Wilson and he is great, Sam is great in Carolina - Loss for us because we had a QB and could have flipped the value from Wilsons pick to make this team better. We also fail to capitalize on Sam performing well in Carolina because we only got a second and not a conditional second. Because of this the 2nd we get is a late second when it could have been a late first

Option 4 

We Take Wilson He sucks, Sam Sucks in carolina - Loss for us - we would have been better to move down and use the value of pick to to build a team and draft a QB next year with a better team to put him on.

Option 5

We keep Sam - He busts  - Wilson Is great - Loss for us, we managed to get additional draft picks so we can still get a QB next year, and with Sam sucking the pick will likely be high, but we did miss out on a great QB

Option 6

We kept sam he busts- Wilson also busts Win for us. We didn't draft a bust in wilson and were able to get a ton of draft capital for pick 2

Option 7

We keep Sam - He is good, Wilson busts - Huge Win for us - get additional picks on trade down and have a young franchise QB.

There are FAR more likely chances to be successful sticking with Sam than there are by trading him and drafting Wilson. Clearly Joe chose to gamble and the odds are stacked against him that this gamble will payoff. Also, your point about calling this a QB rich draft is pretty invalid. Where were Wilson, Lance and Jones ranked this time last year? This was the Lawrence draft, and maybe Fields would be a 1st round pick Now suddenly Fields is being called the 5th QB to be taken despite ending the this past college season as the expected second best QB. Its all about recency hype. Every year there are QBs that come out of nowhere on the hype train to be "can't miss studs". Wilson is no different than someone like Trubisky in that regard. There will be QBs just like him next year. Hell, look at the draft we got Darnold in. That was the suck for Sam year, then after the season the hype train for Baker pushed him over Darnold in the draft. That draft was also considered"loaded at QB btw, and so far Baker has been questionable at best, only really looking good when cleveland loaded up on skills players(something maybe we should have done?) Rosen being DOA, and Darnold apparently busting here. Allen was properly developed in Buffalo where, once again, they did this crazy thing called getting talent around their young QB to help make the game easier for him...(probably should have done that here huh). Baltimore had success with Jackson too, but it was a gimmicky run first offense that needs to prove it can be sustained at this point(not saying Jackson didn't have a great year) 

 

 

You missed the point. JD is getting paid millions of dollars to run this franchise. At times throughout his tenor he will have to make some big boy decisions. This decision is no doubt is one of them. 
 

Can’t not make decisions because you fear the worst case scenario. It’s not like he doesn’t have all the time and resources to make an informed choice. 
 

Regardless if you, I or the other members of of this fan base like his decisions it doesn’t really matter until the results come from those decisions. Two years from now if Wilson is killing it then we will all be happy. If Sam is a pro bowler and we are looking yet again for a new Qb then more than likely Jd will be sacked. 

[KimuraGod]

1 minute ago, drew39k said:

Just because you think he isn't a good quarterback doesn't mean he doesn't have the talent to be a good quarterback. Your opinion does not equate to fact.

The facts are he hasn’t been good though. 🤷🏻‍♂️

[drew39k]

Just now, xenajets said:

You missed the point. JD is getting paid millions of dollars to run this franchise. At times throughout his tenor he will have to make some big boy decisions. This decision is no doubt is one of them. 
 

Can’t not make decisions because you fear the worst case scenario. It’s not like he doesn’t have all the time and resources to make an informed choice. 
 

Regardless if you, I or the other members of of this fan base like his decisions it doesn’t really matter until the results come from those decisions. Two years from now if Wilson is killing it then we will all be happy. If Sam is a pro bowler and we are looking yet again for a new Qb then more than likely Jd will be sacked. 

Who is making decisions based on fear? It's about looking at all the factors and finding the best solution to the issue. The outcome that presents the most positives and least negatives is the best option.

 

And yes, non of what we say has any impact on the franchise. That's kinda obvious,but also completely misses the point of this forum all together. Are we only allowed to praise every decision with the blind hope that they will turn out positive?or are we here to discuss thoughts and opinions in relation to the franchise and how it's run?

 

[drew39k]

4 minutes ago, xenajets said:

The facts are he hasn’t been good though. 🤷🏻‍♂️

The facts are that he has struggled to be successful while being surrounded by a terrible team and arguably the worst coaching in the league.

 

[KimuraGod]

4 minutes ago, drew39k said:

Who is making decisions based on fear? It's about looking at all the factors and finding the best solution to the issue. The outcome that presents the most positives and least negatives is the best option.

 

And yes, non of what we say has any impact on the franchise. That's kinda obvious,but also completely misses the point of this forum all together. Are we only allowed to praise every decision with the blind hope that they will turn out positive?or are we here to discuss thoughts and opinions in relation to the franchise and how it's run?

 

Your original complaint was that ‘what if the trade blows up in Douglas’s face?’ 

That’s very much a case of making decisions based on the worst outcome. Effectively making decisions based on fear and the worst outcome imaginable.

Of course we debate on these things that’s what we as fans do. However Wilson hasn’t even been drafted by us yet so let’s leave the worst case scenarios to one side for now. 
 

I completely understand if you don’t think JD has done enough so far because I agree but you can’t complain about making a big big decision and hopefully getting us a franchise qb. 
 

Sam hasn’t been that for us and likely wouldn’t ever be that. He had not had the pieces to succeed but he’s also not played well to be quite frank. Best move for everyone is a clean break. 
 

 

[ekill08x]

1 hour ago, GangGreen420 said:

We aren’t obligated to praise every move this team makes. Cause you know it’s been such a successful decade 

yeah but we make good moves to accumulate draft equity and its all the same "but we suck at drafting". It is always negative. At least this regime is trying to operate the way successful organizations do, when have we had that this decade lol?

[Rockice_8]

2 hours ago, KingOfNewYork said:

Sam's a good guy, he just throws too many picks. Panthers run a vertical offense so hopefully he adapts well. 

His deep ball is pretty bad.  Don't get the fit honestly.

[Rockice_8]

2 hours ago, jetfuel34 said:

Well the clock has now started on JD and Saleh. The pick will be Zach Wilson. I hope I'm wrong here and hope he turns out to be a stud. I still think T Law is the only QB here in this draft. If the Jets are not in the playoffs by 2023 the fans will be out to hang these guys. As a Jet fan I'm just tired of the rest set ever 3 years. I have a feeling this will be no diffrent. I'm not sold on just what people say. I want action not words. If the Jets can win 5 or 6 games this year and 8 or 9 next year then I will start to believe. I have been burned too many times with this team. 

What are you looking for in a QB prospect if you only think there is one QB in this draft?

[KodiakThunder]

This trade is a massive coup for JD. He has shown to be EXTREMELY shrewd with trades, winning every trade he's made for is thus far (from a value perspective). 

I would love to see his scouting dept be as apt and shrewd as he is with trades but that's asking a lot. Most "good" drafting teams hit on 50% of their picks or so. 

A lot of people are claiming JDs 2020 draft was "meh". And maybe so, however I think his draft looks much better than he gets credit for. 

He hit 3 homeruns in Becton,  Hall, and Mann. There's also several others where the jury is still out (Perine, Mims, Davis, Clark). 

Mims looks like he could be a stud with a good QB, and Clark/Perine were always developmental. Clark had a lost year with injuries and reps, I wouldn't write him off yet. Davis disappointed a bit but played relatviely well considering what was being asked of him. 

I also wouldn't be surprised to see us trade up from #23 for an Olineman. Vera-Tucker could be a steal in the mid/late teens. 

With 20 picks the next two years and tons of cap room JD has allowed the rebuild to actually take root but investing in the future.

With all out picks, if JD hits on 3 or 4 picks the next two years we will be incredibly competitive.  If Wilson is everything I believe he is, then we may be fighting the Bill's for 1st in 2023. 

[JetsFan15]

This was the right move. I think many, including myself, have a soft spot for Sam. So much hope and hype when he was drafted. Showed good promise his rookie year. Then regressed.  No other way to say it.  We can blame Gase all we want and he might very well be the major issue. But Sam regressed, period. 
 

It was time for a change of scenery for Sam and the Jets.  They obviously have Wilson or Fields or someone rated as high if not higher than Sam.  Then you need to make this move and not look back. Reset the financial clock and have a ton of 1-3 round picks the next two years.  This is where JD will either change the franchise or not.  Obviously the #2 is a huge piece but the more help you can surround our new QB with the more success he will have. 
 
I really hope Sam ends up being a solid starter in the league. He is a class act and stand up guy.  

[KingOfNewYork]

1 hour ago, ekill08x said:

yeah but we make good moves to accumulate draft equity and its all the same "but we suck at drafting". It is always negative. At least this regime is trying to operate the way successful organizations do, when have we had that this decade lol?

It's going to be negative until we win and even then they'll find something to complain about. I get it because its been 10 years of dreadful football but thats not on this regime and they're at least trying to do things in a way to build sustainable success.

It just seems like guys want an overnight success at times.