Aaron Rodgers Appreciation Thread 4.20

[Packerraymond]

Just now, Outpost31 said:

That’s kinda the entire point.  Quarterbacks shouldn’t be paid this amount of money in their mid thirties.  And actually Brady has never in his career taken up this cap percentage.

You and I have been down this road many times before. QB pay is what it is, doesn't seem to be going down if you don't have a rookie QB a vet willing to take paycuts for a ring is the next best option.

[{Family Ghost}]

1 minute ago, Packerraymond said:

You and I have been down this road many times before. QB pay is what it is, doesn't seem to be going down if you don't have a rookie QB a vet willing to take paycuts for a ring is the next best option.

Rodgers cap percent is pretty reasonable for 2020 at 10.35%.  He could be a big bargain next year if he can tighten his game up and improve his accuracy.

[coachbuns]

1 hour ago, Outpost31 said:

Yeah, because fans like Polaris who were saying Favre needs to go four years before he actually left cursed us post-Favre. 

How many years does a player get to live off what they've done in the past?  Because Rodgers has not been elite since the divisional round of the 2014 playoffs. 

6.7 yards per attempt, 92.7 rating.
7.3 yards per attempt, 104.7 rating.
7.0 yards per attempt, 97.2 rating.
7.4 yards per attempt, 97.6 rating.
7.0 yards per attempt, 95.4 rating.

7.08 yards per attempt since 2015 is embarrassing.  Ryan Tannehill has 7.9 yards per attempt since 2015. 

Those are elite numbers if you're a quarterback in 1999-2009. 

Rodgers this year is 10th in touchdowns.  That's the only thing he's top ten in.

19th in completion percentage (Trubisky completed at a higher rate).
So did Hodges and Rudolph.  HODGES AND RUDOLPH. 
11th in yardage. 
20th in yards per attempt.  That is embarrassing. 

The single two things you can look at to measure future success for a QB is completion percentage and yards per attempt. 

Out of 50 rookie quarterbacks to start a minimum of three games since 2010, 16 have had more yards per attempt than Rodgers has had this year.

TIM TEBOW HAD MORE YARDS PER ATTEMPT THAN RODGERS IN HIS ROOKIE YEAR. 

How are we cursing our next QB?  You act like we are crapping on a blessing when Rodgers is not a blessing.  I know people who don't know how to argue will say stuff like, "Whatever you say, man.  LOL at Prescott is better than Rodgers, lol," but 19 quarterbacks in this league have a higher completion percentage.  20 have more yards per attempt.  This isn't 2005 anymore where quarterback options are limited.  We have a head coach who got 68% on completions and 7.6 yards per attempt with Marcus Mariota in one year. 

Drew Lock was just taken in the second round of this year's draft and for Vic Fangio, after trading away their best receiver, in his rookie year, he completed 64% of his passes for 6.5 yards per attempt and you're acting like it's impossible to find another good QB. 

It's not.  Rodgers sucks.  Half the starting quarterbacks in the league would give us a better offense. 

 

 

Good gosh this gets old.  We get it … Rodgers sucks.  That being said, how do you fix this?  We are stuck with him like it or not … and your complaining incessantly about it.  Nothing is going to change … nothing.

Edited December 31, 2019 by coachbuns

[PACKRULE]

35 minutes ago, Outpost31 said:

That’s kinda the entire point.  Quarterbacks shouldn’t be paid this amount of money in their mid thirties.  And actually Brady has never in his career taken up this cap percentage.

How much do we pay for him to not turn the ball over, manage the offense and have WR's and TE's drop the ball. Yes as noted everyone has noted AR is not what he was. But drops plague him and do affect him and our game. He was bad the other night in Detroit but had those 5-7 catchable balls been caught things look allot better. His guys let him down allot fun fact.

[MacReady]

Just now, coachbuns said:

Good gosh this gets old.  We get it … Rodgers sucks.  That being said, how do you fix this?  We are stuck with him like it or not … and your complaining incessantly about it.  Nothing is going to change … nothing.

Honestly the only thing that can fix it is Rodgers. 

AARON RODGERS IS CAPABLE OF BEING THE BEST QB IN THE LEAGUE IF HE GETS OUT OF HIS OWN WAY.

Literally all it takes is changing his mentality.  He needs to take more chances.  He needs to work on his accuracy.  He needs to stop pretending he can still hit those Davante Adams against the Jaguars plays where he throws off balance.  He cannot do that anymore.

There is NOTHING preventing Rodgers from playing as well as Brees, Brady, Manning, Favre in their later years.  NOTHING.  He still has the arm strength.  He no longer has the off-balance arm strength and accuracy.

He needs to work on his pass accuracy on touch passes to backs.  He needs to throw over the middle of the field.  He needs to give his receivers LEGITIMATE CHANCES. 

There still is a chance that he turns it around.  I've seen him do a lot of things this year that he flat out did not do 2015-2018.  LaFleur's influence is showing, but currently it's not enough. 

I have plenty of hope/faith that next year will be Aaron's best year since 2016 at least.  If you take away his excuses (talent around him), his pride will not let him continue to get the blame that he cannot escape from this year.  Adams/Lazard/mid-tier free agent/second round draft pick is instantly the best receiving corps he's had since 2011.  Lazard looks to be a legit option moving forward, and MVS still has potential (not this year his confidence is shot this year). 

He can only refuse to throw to so many open receivers. 

[MacReady]

Just now, PACKRULE said:

How much do we pay for him to not turn the ball over, manage the offense and have WR's and TE's drop the ball. Yes as noted everyone has noted AR is not what he was. But drops plague him and do affect him and our game. He was bad the other night in Detroit but had those 5-7 catchable balls been caught things look allot better. His guys let him down allot fun fact.

Lol.  5-7 catchable balls?  He threw 5-7 uncatchable balls.  Three that should have been huge gains to Aaron Jones.  He is literally the worst QB in the league at throwing touch passes to running backs.  It's like that is the first thing quarterbacks learn as a safety valve and Aaron can't do that because he's refused to do it his entire career.  He is his own handicap. 

[Gopher Trace]

 me: that feel when two sides are arguing bitterly against each other yet you think both sides are basically correct.

[PACKRULE]

 

2 minutes ago, Outpost31 said:

Honestly the only thing that can fix it is Rodgers. 

AARON RODGERS IS CAPABLE OF BEING THE BEST QB IN THE LEAGUE IF HE GETS OUT OF HIS OWN WAY.

Literally all it takes is changing his mentality.  He needs to take more chances.  He needs to work on his accuracy.  He needs to stop pretending he can still hit those Davante Adams against the Jaguars plays where he throws off balance.  He cannot do that anymore.

There is NOTHING preventing Rodgers from playing as well as Brees, Brady, Manning, Favre in their later years.  NOTHING.  He still has the arm strength.  He no longer has the off-balance arm strength and accuracy.

He needs to work on his pass accuracy on touch passes to backs.  He needs to throw over the middle of the field.  He needs to give his receivers LEGITIMATE CHANCES. 

There still is a chance that he turns it around.  I've seen him do a lot of things this year that he flat out did not do 2015-2018.  LaFleur's influence is showing, but currently it's not enough. 

I have plenty of hope/faith that next year will be Aaron's best year since 2016 at least.  If you take away his excuses (talent around him), his pride will not let him continue to get the blame that he cannot escape from this year.  Adams/Lazard/mid-tier free agent/second round draft pick is instantly the best receiving corps he's had since 2011.  Lazard looks to be a legit option moving forward, and MVS still has potential (not this year his confidence is shot this year). 

He can only refuse to throw to so many open receivers. 

All good points and true. Change is never easy espeically for athletes and AR has quite a bit of Favre in him whether he'd ever admit it or not. My hope is from this season is that he made some strides. At times he does play within the offence. At times he hit the RB's for good yards. If he hits with MLF on a couple of the other things you pointed out there is no limit to what we can't do. A couple upgrades at slot and WR would be great as well:)

[PACKRULE]

5 minutes ago, Outpost31 said:

Lol.  5-7 catchable balls?  He threw 5-7 uncatchable balls.  Three that should have been huge gains to Aaron Jones.  He is literally the worst QB in the league at throwing touch passes to running backs.  It's like that is the first thing quarterbacks learn as a safety valve and Aaron can't do that because he's refused to do it his entire career.  He is his own handicap. 

OP, you are so much like AR it's funny. I mean sometimes the ball has to be close enough to get dam hands on it and guys have to make plays we do pay DA 15 mil per year.. He and other QB's are not God's they all make throws that are off by a bit. When a guy can get 2 hands on it that should be caught and I recall at least 3 that should have been and there were a couple more drops. Did Graham need a better throw to catch on AR's first pass. Yes, I noted there were some bad throws too. That dump off to Jones on the inside screen was magic in the 4th. The easiest thing in the world though is to pick the flaws..........but you often fail to ackknowledge some of the good at the same time from AR. He did complete 27 passes in the game. Some where dam fine throws. Again that short toss to Jones was a beauty but not perfect but Jones caught the dam ball.

I think and believe one thing that hurts AR is how good he can throw the ball actaully. MM used to never get him in a grove he would just have him chuck it everywhere. He rarely gets a few gimme's to start games and get him going. MLF has been guilty of this too. 

[St Vince]

Instead of Rodgers working to fix his deficiencies over the next two weeks he'll be with Danica walking around IKEA stores decorating their 28 million dollar love nest. 

[Packerraymond]

Rodgers can definitely throw off balance still in the short-mid range game. His throw on the run is still elite. Just something up with the deep ball this year. I was in that dome, still looks absolutely beautiful coming out and spins in a way that I'm sure makes the NFL films videographer tingle, but it's just not landing in the bucket like we're used to. Might be the massive range in speed between MVS to Graham? When it was prime Jennings, Jordy, Jones, Finley Driver, those guys were all 4.4-4.6 guys. You've got MVS and Ervin in the 4.3s, Adams, Jones and Lazard in the 4.5s, Kumerow and Allison high 4.6s, Graham is probably high 4.8s now. Just spitballing, but he's definitely closest on Adams, he hit him on one, Adams dropped one and then the deep middle throw was close. 

[squire12]

5 minutes ago, Packerraymond said:

Rodgers can definitely throw off balance still in the short-mid range game. His throw on the run is still elite. Just something up with the deep ball this year. I was in that dome, still looks absolutely beautiful coming out and spins in a way that I'm sure makes the NFL films videographer tingle, but it's just not landing in the bucket like we're used to. Might be the massive range in speed between MVS to Graham? When it was prime Jennings, Jordy, Jones, Finley Driver, those guys were all 4.4-4.6 guys. You've got MVS and Ervin in the 4.3s, Adams, Jones and Lazard in the 4.5s, Kumerow and Allison high 4.6s, Graham is probably high 4.8s now. Just spitballing, but he's definitely closest on Adams, he hit him on one, Adams dropped one and then the deep middle throw was close. 

Agreed that Rodgers can still sling it like previous years, but the consistency is not there. Fewer and farther between with the accurate throws.  The sloppier the footwork and mechanics will lead to more inconsistency.  Sometimes in all syncs up and you get the dimes, other times it is just a bit off and you get the airmails or the ball at the WR feet.

[Packer_ESP]

58 minutes ago, Outpost31 said:

Yeah, because fans like Polaris who were saying Favre needs to go four years before he actually left cursed us post-Favre. 

How many years does a player get to live off what they've done in the past?  Because Rodgers has not been elite since the divisional round of the 2014 playoffs. 

6.7 yards per attempt, 92.7 rating.
7.3 yards per attempt, 104.7 rating.
7.0 yards per attempt, 97.2 rating.
7.4 yards per attempt, 97.6 rating.
7.0 yards per attempt, 95.4 rating.

I'm partial to ANYA myself, which is a bit more complete than raw YPA. I just compiled Rodger's career info as a starter as I was particularly interested in seeing how it compares to his peers, given the evolution of the rules and the passing game around the league. This is what I've got:

		LEAGUE			RODGERS			
YEAR		ANYA	STD.DEV		RANK	ANYA	DIF	STD.DEV
2008		5,91	1,09		10	6,64	0,73	0,67
2009		5,91	1,57		6	7,47	1,56	0,99
2010		5,96	1,08		3	7,50	1,54	1,43
2011		6,03	1,30		1	9,39	3,36	2,59
2012		6,10	0,98		5	7,33	1,23	1,26
2013		5,98	1,27		4	8,00	2,02	1,60
2014		6,26	1,04		1	8,65	2,39	2,30
2015		6,42	0,93		21	6,10	-0,32	-0,35
2016		6,37	1,21		6	7,24	0,87	0,71
2017		6,03	1,16		17	5,99	-0,04	-0,03
2018		6,53	1,11		10	6,96	0,43	0,39
2019		6,42	1,15		11	6,71	0,29	0,25

Statistics wise, you could very well argue that an "average" quarterback is going to be within a standard deviation of a given efficiency stat - in this case, ANYA. Rodgers has been more than one standard deviation better than the league from 2009 to 2014, including two otherworldly years leading the league with more than 2 standard deviations above the mean. The last five years though, he's been quite closer to average in this regard, other than maybe 2016.

[Mazrimiv]

GB had been playing within Mac's system for what, 13 years?  Everyone was starting over with MLF, not just Rodgers, so there's been a lot of opportunity for things to look out of sync.  From a learning standpoint, Rodgers has been on cruise control for quite a while, which I'm sure wasn't helping his ability to adjust to a new system.  Call that an excuse if you want, but that's the reality.  It always seemed likely that the first year under MLF would be a little rocky for Rodgers, but I still have hope that things will look smoother in year two.  Rodgers can be an arrogant SOB, but I fully expect he knows as well as anyone how many plays he's left on the field this season.

Edited December 31, 2019 by Mazrimiv

[Packerraymond]

4 minutes ago, squire12 said:

Agreed that Rodgers can still sling it like previous years, but the consistency is not there. Fewer and farther between with the accurate throws.  The sloppier the footwork and mechanics will lead to more inconsistency.  Sometimes in all syncs up and you get the dimes, other times it is just a bit off and you get the airmails or the ball at the WR feet.

We talk about mechanics a lot, but the supremely talented rarely are repeatable there. I'm not sure how Favre or Rodgers or Mahomes do it, but they are mechanically a mess and always have been. Rodgers talent is still there, I don't think mechanics are the issue because they haven't changed. He's always thrown with a multitude of arm slots, without stepping into throws or even having feet on the ground.

I think it's a multitude of aspects. I think the first signs of natural ability deterioration is starting and he's trying to find the mix of giving it a little more oomph to compensate while still being accurate. I don't think he's consistently on the same page with any WR other than Adams. He had a plethora of plays in his head in Mac's offense where he knew how a DB would react and where the ball should go that he doesn't have anymore and then lastly there is the stubborn factor where his head is also a detriment to him playing to peak level as well.

The other stuff will work itself out, the internal stuff in his head, he has to fix.