MacReady Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 @Packerraymond, you thought I wouldn't see this, but I did. @Norm. @incognito_man @Pugger. @AlexGreen#20. Bottom line is that as a Packer fan, I have been saying this for three years now. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sammymvpknight Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 People see Brady and Brees and automatically think that every good QB plays into their 40s at a high level. When, in reality, even based on comparisons to other HOF QBs, they are unicorns. The general rule is significant decline and inconsistencies past the age of 37. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TecmoSuperJoe Posted August 19, 2020 Author Share Posted August 19, 2020 (edited) 10 hours ago, KingOfNewYork said: If someone is a pro bowler you can call them a pro bowler and it cannot be refuted, same as All Pro. But Elite is baseless, it cannot be proven. A Pro Bowler and All Pro is still based on opinion, not fact. So yes, it can be refuted, because it's a subjective idea. It being on paper and going down in the history books doesn't change that, other than to have evidence exist that people voiced their opinion on who should have had those labels at that specific point in time. The label "elite" is based on the same logic that calling someone an All Pro or Pro Bowler is: an opinion. Edited August 19, 2020 by TecmoSuperJoe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TecmoSuperJoe Posted August 19, 2020 Author Share Posted August 19, 2020 25 minutes ago, sammymvpknight said: People see Brady and Brees and automatically think that every good QB plays into their 40s at a high level. When, in reality, even based on comparisons to other HOF QBs, they are unicorns. The general rule is significant decline and inconsistencies past the age of 37. Even Brees is slowing down with his arm losing battery life at the end of the last couple of seasons when he wasn't hurt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sammymvpknight Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 15 minutes ago, TecmoSuperJoe said: Even Brees is slowing down with his arm losing battery life at the end of the last couple of seasons when he wasn't hurt. I agree about his arm strength...but not even including arm strength...Brady and Brees are the only two QBs that have managed to be consistently elite between the ages of 38-41. Eli is now 39...he’s done. Rivers is entering the season at age 39...he looked spent last year. Big Ben is turning 38 this year...we’ll see if he rebounds after his injury plagued season, I’m doubtful. Rodgers is entering his age 37 season...but boy he doesn’t strike me as a guy who will last. He takes way too many hits and likes to scramble...and also has the injury history. I know exactly what the Packers were thinking when they drafted Love. Rodgers may have 1-2 solid years left. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archimedes Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 How many guys in the league could you replace Rodgers with on the Packers and expect the same or better results last year? Maybe 5? Mahomes Wilson Maybe Watson? Maybe Lamar? Brees? (Brees has been better than Rodgers statistically these last couple of years, but he plays on a much more talented team) So at worst I still have him as a top 6 guy. Moreover, all 5 of those guys play on better teams than Rodgers, and only one can say they took their team further in the playoffs. He may or may not still be elite, but he’s still well past the minimum threshold you’d need for a guy good enough to win the SB with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TecmoSuperJoe Posted August 19, 2020 Author Share Posted August 19, 2020 2 hours ago, sammymvpknight said: I agree about his arm strength...but not even including arm strength...Brady and Brees are the only two QBs that have managed to be consistently elite between the ages of 38-41. Eli is now 39...he’s done. Rivers is entering the season at age 39...he looked spent last year. Big Ben is turning 38 this year...we’ll see if he rebounds after his injury plagued season, I’m doubtful. Rodgers is entering his age 37 season...but boy he doesn’t strike me as a guy who will last. He takes way too many hits and likes to scramble...and also has the injury history. I know exactly what the Packers were thinking when they drafted Love. Rodgers may have 1-2 solid years left. Don't forget Warren Moon. Still had a few good years in that 38-41 range But yes, the sample size is quite small. Everyone slows down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugger Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 10 hours ago, Archimedes said: How many guys in the league could you replace Rodgers with on the Packers and expect the same or better results last year? Maybe 5? Mahomes Wilson Maybe Watson? Maybe Lamar? Brees? (Brees has been better than Rodgers statistically these last couple of years, but he plays on a much more talented team) So at worst I still have him as a top 6 guy. Moreover, all 5 of those guys play on better teams than Rodgers, and only one can say they took their team further in the playoffs. He may or may not still be elite, but he’s still well past the minimum threshold you’d need for a guy good enough to win the SB with. Plus Brees plays half of his games in a dome. We shall see if Rodgers' play improves in his second season in this new offense. Brees has played the majority of his career with Payton. Will Brady be working in a similar offense in Tampa this year? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gmen Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 He's 36 years old. I know we've seen even older QBs play well in recent years, but everyone ages differently. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 11 hours ago, TecmoSuperJoe said: Don't forget Warren Moon. Still had a few good years in that 38-41 range There was another Vikings QB who had some great seasons in his 40s... ... Brett Favre. 😅 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkippyX Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 Matthew Berry on ESPN Fantasy: https://www.espn.com/fantasy/football/story/_/page/TMRlovehate200819/love-hate-fantasy-football-time-corona Quarterbacks I hate in 2020 Aaron Rodgers, Packers: He's an amazing real-life NFL QB, he's going to be a first-ballot Hall of Famer and he is a bad, bad man. But last year's QB13 on a points-per-game basis comes into 2020 off a season where he had the lowest fantasy point total of any in his career in which he played at least 15 games. He had nine weekly finishes of QB20 or worse. Think about that. Want more bad stats? I've got more bad stats. Rodgers was held to fewer than 15 fantasy points in 10 of 16 games last season, was off target on his passes at the fourth-highest rate in the league, and he had his lowest completion percentage since 2015. From Week 9 on, he averaged just 1.3 passing TDs and 209.8 passing yards per game. So to help out their franchise QB, the pass-catchers that the Packers added this year are (checks notes) ... third-round rookie tight end Josiah Deguara. That's it. That's the list. (Free-agent signing Devin Funchess has opted out of the 2020 season.) OK, then. But here's the biggest issue: Matt LaFleur's run-heavy approach worked! It worked great! Green Bay went to the NFC Championship Game last season. Why would the Packers want to go away from that? Given that the team used a second-round pick on 250-pound RB AJ Dillon and did little in the way of adding additional pass-catching help, it seems likely this offense will once again be run-heavy. Rodgers is currently going as QB11 on ESPN, and while he obviously has the talent to earn that and more, I have him comfortably outside of my top 12 QBs for 2020. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunter2_1 Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 I dunno, I kind of think he'll prove a lot of people wrong this season. Not doubting a regression (in that sense I straight up agree with what's being said), but I do think they'll be a bit of a reignition there this season for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jlowe22 Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 Pretty simple really. Rodgers was a physical specimen in his prime, and age and injuries will have an effect on that. Brady and Brees had a game that relies much less on their physical attributes. Even still, in both cases the physical decline is obvious and both are on borrowed time. But also, neither have had the relatively recent injuries like Rodgers. Id also say Rodgers has had less help these last few years, magnifying the issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteelKing728 Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 He'll go off week 1, won't he? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwibrown Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 On 8/18/2020 at 9:22 PM, JAF-N72EX said: Your guess is as good as mine. You're asking this to a bunch of people who also wanna label damn near every QB in the league as a "franchise Qb". What is a franchise qb? Jimmy g? Dak? Wentz? Matt ryan? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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