The Cleveland Browns MUST BENCH Baker Mayfield IMMEDIATELY

[Kip Smithers]

In all honesty, you can’t justify paying him at this rate. He’s a flawed QB and requires an ideal structure in place to succeed. Not sure that justifies paying him what the market dictates. Either offer him a team friendly deal or cut bait. 

[Broncofan]

1 hour ago, Kip Smithers said:

In all honesty, you can’t justify paying him at this rate. He’s a flawed QB and requires an ideal structure in place to succeed. Not sure that justifies paying him what the market dictates. Either offer him a team friendly deal or cut bait. 

The X-factor is CLE's long history of having nothing at QB, and their fear of being left in the cold.

If I were to guess - CLE tries to find an upgrade, on finding none - they franchise tag Baker for a stopgap year and draft QB Rd1.    I don't think there's any way they go into the offseason without a vet QB, even it's Baker - but at the same time, I don't see any way they commit long-term to him after this debacle.  The franchise allows him to re-establish his worth, yet allows CLE to explore the mid-Rd1 where TBH I think they'll find 1-2 guys who will drop because they don't have  the true elite franchise QB ceiling - but they'll offer a cheap rookie-level deal, and frankly by 2022, may not be any worse than Baker is now, but will have at least some room to grow/learn.   That's the issue with Baker - it's not like his flaws are getting better.   What he does well (quick reads, accurate thrower) and what he doesn't do well (limited arm, limited play extending ability, compounded by a belief in his skills & mobility that isn't warranted, and leads to sacks/etc.), are pretty static right now. 

Edited December 26, 2021 by Broncofan

[43M]

I honestly wouldnt mind Cleveland letting him walk and the Steelers picking him up.

Baker may never be a franchise QB, but at worst, I think he will hang around the league in kind of a Ryan Fitzpatrick or Tyrod Taylor-esque way and be a stop gap throughout his career.

At best, I could see him having a Carson Wentz type of resurgence where he still isnt great, but can still be a winning QB in the right situation.

I think he stays in Cleveland for the next year or two, though.   I dont see him getting a huge deal, but I could see him getting like a 2 year/$45 million with modest guarantees that make him easy to cut after the first year.   I do see Cleveland drafting another QB.

[BrownLeader]

1 hour ago, Forge said:

Sitting him is not an indictment of his true talent, but rather how he's playing right now because he's not healthy. If he can't understand that, that's a different problem.

Kind of a different problem then. He's healthy enough to be playing much better so sitting him would exactly be an indictment of his talent. It would effectively end his time in Cleveland with this staff given his volatile temperament and no one is ready to cross that bridge yet.

1 hour ago, Broncofan said:

The X-factor is CLE's long history of having nothing at QB, and their fear of being left in the cold.

If I were to guess - CLE tries to find an upgrade, on finding none - they franchise tag Baker for a stopgap year and draft QB Rd1.    I don't think there's any way they go into the offseason without a vet QB, even it's Baker - but at the same time, I don't see any way they commit long-term to him after this debacle.  The franchise allows him to re-establish his worth, yet allows CLE to explore the mid-Rd1 where TBH I think they'll find 1-2 guys who will drop because they don't have  the true elite franchise QB ceiling - but they'll offer a cheap rookie-level deal, and frankly by 2022, may not be any worse than Baker is now, but will have at least some room to grow/learn.   That's the issue with Baker - it's not like his flaws are getting better.   What he does well (quick reads, accurate thrower) and what he doesn't do well (limited arm, limited play extending ability, compounded by a belief in his skills & mobility that isn't warranted, and leads to sacks/etc.), are pretty static right now. 

The past history shouldn't factor into things for this FO barring the owner getting involved again. They've managed to field a good team around the incumbent QB. There are probably some that are actually looking forward to finding their own guy.

Idk about round 1 but that seems a likely scenario.

eh.. on the take with what he does/doesn't do well. He's accurate yes, but making quick reads isn't a strength. Isn't good at improvising but he's got a cannon arm. ..but agreed on the point that he's not really improving on his weaknesses.

[evilpimp972]

4 hours ago, AkronsWitness said:

Here's my thing. I find it hard to believe that Baker went from playing fantastic last year where it was all coming together.....to complete garbage to this extent.

That's why I think his injury has a ton to do with his recent play this year. That and the fact his WRs are horrible and can't get consistent separation to save their lives.

When he played for a drive in the preseason, he was throwing lasers. Even week 1 against KC this year he threw for 300+ yards and 75% completion. Then the injury happened in week 2 and it's been a Trainwreck ever since.

So while I understand he has been liquid garbage this year, there is pretty clear evidence that his injury in week 2 lines up perfectly with his massive decline in production

 

 

His Wrs were the same last year no?

If I remember they tried to tell us OBJ was the problem, given the sample size of games without him Baker was great

If you gotta make so many excuses about your qb, he is not your guy

[BigTrav]

AnD itS nOt EvEn cLOse

But apart from that annoying part I agree. Must move on.

[MWil23]

10 hours ago, biggie. said:

Everyone is playing hurt! He's played poorly even before these "injuries".

He was hurt halfway through week 2

[NYRaider]

I thought he was going to cement himself as a top 10 QB?

[MWil23]

Limbo land is always the worst place to be. Whether it’s the NBA and you’re a fringe playoff team missing out on elite prospects when you’d be better off being awful, or Quarterback limbo like where we are now. There’s not going to be a definitively better option than Baker without warts, and even then you’re trading a lot and hoping for things to come together with no trade clauses getting waived.

Wilson looks lousy right now and has a couple of good receivers but has an awful OL and middling at best run game. His contract is enormous and he’d have to waive a no trade clause.

Watson is probably a predator.

We are in a position to draft about the fifth or sixth best quarterback in a super weak class this year.

Let’s just run it back next year and hope that Baker is healthy and also be realistic about having a “move on plan” after his fifth year is done.

I actually like Baker’s attitude as a whole and intangibles, but he hasn’t gotten better against pressure, reading a defense, or turning the ball over since the day we drafted him, and that’s alarming.

[43M]

9 minutes ago, MWil23 said:

There’s not going to be a definitively better option than Baker without warts

This is basically what it comes down to.   And give the Browns luck with QBs, it would be a huge risk just to cut ties with no plan in place.

Baker isnt that good, but what better options will there be?  

Wilson and Watson, you have to give up both high picks and a huge salary, which COULD be worth it, but there are enormous risk factors for both.     I think Wilson at the right price could be a good option, but it will really depend how many picks Seattle will want....and he hasnt looked great most of the year.      Watson feels like a trojan horse trade at this point.

Rodgers?     Not convinced he will be traded, but he will be 39 and it might take 2 or 3 firsts to get him.      Is it worth that risk?   

Everyone else is, at best, on the same level as Baker.     If you can get Baker for a decent 2 year contract, Id stick with him and look for a new QB the next 2 years.

[MWil23]

8 minutes ago, 43M said:

This is basically what it comes down to.   And give the Browns luck with QBs, it would be a huge risk just to cut ties with no plan in place.

Baker isnt that good, but what better options will there be?  

Wilson and Watson, you have to give up both high picks and a huge salary, which COULD be worth it, but there are enormous risk factors for both.     I think Wilson at the right price could be a good option, but it will really depend how many picks Seattle will want....and he hasnt looked great most of the year.      Watson feels like a trojan horse trade at this point.

Correct

8 minutes ago, 43M said:

Rodgers?     Not convinced he will be traded, but he will be 39 and it might take 2 or 3 firsts to get him.      Is it worth that risk?   
 

Yes he is. He’s still playing at an elite level. He would absolutely make this team a Super Bowl contender now, but that’s likely a pipe dream.

8 minutes ago, 43M said:

Everyone else is, at best, on the same level as Baker.     If you can get Baker for a decent 2 year contract, Id stick with him and look for a new QB the next 2 years.

 

[ThatJerkDave]

9 hours ago, TecmoSuperJoe said:

Won't he at least get one more year because of the 5th year option? 

 

He is an 18 million dollar QB next season.  That is a tie for 15th in 2022, at least right now.  They can probably lower that hit for next season, if they extend him.  But it isn't like they are hurting for cap space.  Is Baker a guy to put that much money into? 

I think he is absolutely the reason the Packers won.  The Browns were the best tackling team I have seen in a long time.  Our guys were getting zero yards after contact.  They were also running for a ridiculous YPC with Chubb.  But when they put the ball in Baker's hands, he put it in the Packers' hands.  And IIRC, he had 3 more that hit the defenders right in the hands, but they dropped.  In a 2 point game, that is unacceptable.  

[StatKing]

7 hours ago, Forge said:

If you're relying on this version of Baker Mayfield to save your season, it's already over. Again, this version of Baker may be worse than Keenum and you should still be trying to win games. It's unlikely they get in, but not impossible. 

Also, sitting him or starting him has no impact on him being a lame duck QB next year. Until he has a contract past next year, he's a lame duck QB (though you could argue the existence of the franchise tag would preclude any QB from ever truly being a lame duck). 

Sitting him is not an indictment of his true talent, but rather how he's playing right now because he's not healthy. If he can't understand that, that's a different problem.

I'm not sure how the goal is to get him healthy but also keep playing him so it potentially exacerbates the injury and makes it worse? 

I mean you can say sitting him isn't an indictment against his talent but I doubt thats how he'll see it. Any move they make right now should be hedging towards next year. The guy is obviously a very ego driven player, shattering his ego and then expecting to maximize him next year is foolish in my opinion. Theres nothing to be gained by starting Case Keenum, even if they somehow sneak into the playoffs with him they arent winning the Super Bowl.

[candyman93]

9 hours ago, Tk3 said:

I mostly agree

It's weird because I look with my eyes and I THINK I see WRs messing up all over the place

It's also weird that its otherwise pretty good WRs (Landry, OBJ) who are suddenly bad. It makes me wonder if what I'm seeing is incorrect and its a bigger issue

It's just too much of a coincidence that ALL his receivers suck and not even a nobody is able to step up when given opportunities

We just need ONE guy to be a 1000+ yard WR. If we can get a guy like that we will be back in the playoffs next year.

 

Our defense proved it’s not a fluke. It was hammered by COVID and injuries, but still balled out. We didn’t rely on turnovers and we faced the best QBs in the NFL, so they should translate next year provided we resign Clowney.

 

I expect playoffs next season.

Edited December 26, 2021 by candyman93

[squire12]

8 hours ago, Forge said:

Who cares about facts. Just completely useless

Statking, not factking

Keep up here @Forge