BackinBlack Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 On 10/14/2021 at 5:39 PM, Chali21 said: Actually his ceiling is 10-6. Lol I think Carr is good enough to win in like an Alex Smith way but I agree that the Raiders need to move on he’s gone through 2 rebuilds going on 3. No way the next regime is going to keep him when they can get a Kyler Murray or Lamar Jackson or a Patrick Mahomes. Of course this seasons rookies should give many GMs pause. On another note man the Carr Brothers got screwed in the NFL. They could have had better careers on other teams. Especially David. I don’t understand why everyone just thinks we can get a Mahommes / Murray or Jackson lol. what if our next head coach says I want to keep Carr lol. Some of the Carr haters will lose their mind. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrOaktown_56 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 2 hours ago, BackinBlack said: How is someone’s ceiling a record he’s already beaten by 3 games going into week 17? Maybe I’m reading wrong, but a ceiling is if everything is perfect, yea? Carr was 11-4 at one point. with one game left is it not fair to say his ceiling is either 11-5-12-4? No way our ceiling is 8-8. We went 8-8 last year with a clown DC and the 31st ranked scoring defense. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Raider Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 3 hours ago, BackinBlack said: How is someone’s ceiling a record he’s already beaten by 3 games going into week 17? Maybe I’m reading wrong, but a ceiling is if everything is perfect, yea? Carr was 11-4 at one point. with one game left is it not fair to say his ceiling is either 11-5-12-4? He was actually 12-3 in games he started in 2016. We won that Colts game he got injured in, and he led us to a big enough lead mid way through the 4th quarter to hold on for the victory. So really Carr has shown he can play at a high enough level individually that with the right team around him, he can be the QB on a 12 or 13 win team, and if I remember correctly we still had a shot at the 1 seed before his injury. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 4 hours ago, BackinBlack said: I don’t understand why everyone just thinks we can get a Mahommes / Murray or Jackson lol. what if our next head coach says I want to keep Carr lol. Some of the Carr haters will lose their mind. The Carr argument is funny. You call people "haters" but reality is, most like him. But we don't ignore inconsistencies in his game. He has to get over the hump so to speak. Finish the season with wins in Nov/Dec. Get to the playoffs. Win in the playoffs. That's the next level for Carr. If the next head coach wants to keep him, great. Show us you can elevate his game to that next level. Same time, as I said at the time with all the draft ammo... go get the right QB. Get Murray, get Herbert and you can't argue the team might have been better for it as good as Carr can be. You can't get Mahommes, Jackson, Murray if your content with your Daltons, Staffords, Cousins or the world. You have to take the chance. Mahommes never happens if Andy decides Alex Smith is "good enough". 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 1 hour ago, MrOaktown_56 said: No way our ceiling is 8-8. We went 8-8 last year with a clown DC and the 31st ranked scoring defense. He's had 1 season in which he was over that mark 2016. That was a down year in the AFC. Pre Mahommes and Herbert who he will face 4 times each year. Last 2 seasons he fell apart in the second half of the season. This team could be 10-7 or 7-10 and it will largely depend on Carr down the stretch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakdb36 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 Alex Smith had 15 TDs in 15 starts in 2016. It was an easy decision. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucksavage1 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 1 hour ago, oakdb36 said: Alex Smith had 15 TDs in 15 starts in 2016. It was an easy decision. Alex Smith was also taking KC to the playoffs but he had limitations to his game that couldnt get them to the top of the league. Carr hasn't played in the playoffs before, cant count the 12-3 year because he got unfortnately injured Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BackinBlack Posted October 20, 2021 Share Posted October 20, 2021 (edited) 4 hours ago, big_palooka said: The Carr argument is funny. You call people "haters" but reality is, most like him. But we don't ignore inconsistencies in his game. He has to get over the hump so to speak. Finish the season with wins in Nov/Dec. Get to the playoffs. Win in the playoffs. That's the next level for Carr. If the next head coach wants to keep him, great. Show us you can elevate his game to that next level. Same time, as I said at the time with all the draft ammo... go get the right QB. Get Murray, get Herbert and you can't argue the team might have been better for it as good as Carr can be. You can't get Mahommes, Jackson, Murray if your content with your Daltons, Staffords, Cousins or the world. You have to take the chance. Mahommes never happens if Andy decides Alex Smith is "good enough". I’d say most don’t ignore his flaws those. All I’ve ever said is give this guy a half decent defense and some capable wrs and a HC who understands a game and build this team proper, and see where it goes. If Carr is calling at playoff appearances with that, then you make the move. to draft a QB in the first, improve the Oline and trade picks for D, sounds unlikely. We are actually building right now, don’t need to go full rebuild. I agree with your last point but maybe Mahommes also doesn’t happen if he doesn’t end up on a stacked team, with a great HC. That team was in playoffs with Smith, as you’ve said, raiders are 4 wins without Carr. acting like it’s all just Mahommes or any of the great QBs is just not accurate IMO. - that said it’s the DC thread and I’m still pumped he is playing well for us. I hope he can put the late season struggles argument to bed! Edited October 20, 2021 by BackinBlack 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BackinBlack Posted October 20, 2021 Share Posted October 20, 2021 (edited) Also, I’d say most on this site do like Carr or understand his value. When I say hater I’m typically speaking a bout people at Bars / stadium. he was bood out of Oakland last game, is pretty well known a lot of raiders fans hate him. Edited October 20, 2021 by BackinBlack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted October 20, 2021 Share Posted October 20, 2021 (edited) 9 hours ago, BackinBlack said: I don’t understand why everyone just thinks we can get a Mahommes / Murray or Jackson lol. what if our next head coach says I want to keep Carr lol. Some of the Carr haters will lose their mind. A HC will always say he wants to keep Carr, unless a QB better is there in the draft. We would have taken Kyler if he was there. We would have taken Herbert if he was there. Carr is not some great QB that you automatically don’t look for an upgrade. You still look for an upgrade, but Carr usually does just well enough to keep you out of reach. Have to give props on that at least. If we ever pick Top 5-6 and there’s a solid QB Prospect, he’s as good as gone. Luckily for him, we’re never that bad. And yes, I do realize he’s a big part of why we’re never that bad. He’s also a big part why we’re never super good either and fold down the stretch. Not the sole culprit, but a culprit nonetheless. Edited October 20, 2021 by BayRaider Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BackinBlack Posted October 20, 2021 Share Posted October 20, 2021 2 minutes ago, BayRaider said: A HC will always say he wants to keep Carr, unless a QB better is there in the draft. We would have taken Kyler if he was there. We would have taken Herbert if he was there. Carr is not some great QB that you automatically don’t look for an upgrade. You still look for an upgrade, but Carr usually does just well enough to keep you out of reach. Have to give props on that at least. If we ever pick Top 5-6 and there’s a solid QB Prospect, he’s as good as gone. Luckily for him, we’re never that bad. And yes, I do realize he’s a big part of why we’re never that bad. He’s also a big part why we’re never super good either and fold down the stretch. Not the sole culprit, but a culprit nonetheless. I mean yes I agree it’s smart for a coach to say they like Carr. Keep his trade value up that way. It’s also smart for a coach to say they are looking at QBs in the draft may make someone trade up in front of you and push your guy down. I don’t know that we would have taken Murray at 4 or Herbert 2 years ago. I’m not privy to those discussions. thankfully we didn’t take a Haskins or Jones. im all for taking a sure fire thing but those just aren’t there. Mahommes went at what 11? I think we can all agree looking back he’d go 1. we all want to look at kc and see what they did with smith and mahommes, but they first built the team up. with or without Carr, we are probably at the bottom of our division in terms of talent 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raidr4life Posted October 20, 2021 Share Posted October 20, 2021 10 hours ago, BackinBlack said: I don’t understand why everyone just thinks we can get a Mahommes / Murray or Jackson lol. what if our next head coach says I want to keep Carr lol. Some of the Carr haters will lose their mind. Not if Carr continues to play like he has, every single person here has seen the improvment in Carr's game whether you hated him or loved him. he's making plays with his feet , extending plays and making chunk play's that's all you can ask for . Also taking some hits to make plays now, nobody wants Carr to hurt himself but you have to show that toughness sometime. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted October 20, 2021 Share Posted October 20, 2021 (edited) 37 minutes ago, raidr4life said: Not if Carr continues to play like he has, every single person here has seen the improvment in Carr's game whether you hated him or loved him. he's making plays with his feet , extending plays and making chunk play's that's all you can ask for . Also taking some hits to make plays now, nobody wants Carr to hurt himself but you have to show that toughness sometime. Carr has certainly improved some things. When it comes to throwing the ball, he definitely is a lot more aggressive these days, and less scared to throw in a bit of traffic as well. His play extension has gotten better but I’d still say he’s Bottom 10 in the league in that. I also think Bosa’s comments are correct in that you hit him a few times and his mindset/psyche totally changes. With that said, he’s one of the most accurate QB’s in the league and has a solid arm. Those two things alone make him a good QB. No one is calling Carr terrible. He’s a good QB. And you don’t upgrade a good QB with another good QB. You upgrade a good QB with a great QB or great QB prospect. Those just don’t grow on trees like many have mentioned. I wish Carr would ascend and become “great” but simple fact of the matter is he’s never gonna be an Aaron Rodgers, Tom Brady, Josh Allen, Russell Wilson, Patrick Mahomes level of QB. The type of QBs that usually win the Super Bowl. Some will argue he’s already on that level (Franie, Humble, etc) but the fact is he’s not and never will be that level. Honestly I’m trying to praise him more than anything, although don’t know if I’m doing a good job at that. Carr is good. Not a Super Bowl winning QB though without a semi-legendary #1 ranked defense IMO. I wanted a trade up for Fields the past draft, so we’ll see how that goes over the next few years. Edited October 20, 2021 by BayRaider Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Posted October 20, 2021 Share Posted October 20, 2021 I would still argue that he's a top 10-15 QB. I like him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrOaktown_56 Posted October 20, 2021 Share Posted October 20, 2021 1 hour ago, Jerry said: I would still argue that he's a top 10-15 QB. I like him. So do I. Bare minimum. I actually think if we let him throw as much as he wants he'll hit a new level this year. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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