Wide Receiver Outlook

[Mazrimiv]

I expect the team will keep 7 WR's initially, and then make a decision when Jones returns.

[Mazrimiv]

5 minutes ago, Leader said:

Well unless Davis is gonna get an outright "pass" on this years TC and make the roster again solely for his return skills - MVS has the (endangered) KO returns down and JJ can handle the PRs.

That said and realizing it has nothing to do with the WR position - which was the thrust of your comment - I'd have no problem fitting EQ or MVS into the passing game mix - this year. Get them the ball. Good things will happen. Trust me.

You can put them on the field, but I doubt Rodgers will be looking their way.  His comments about the scout team performance tell you all you need to know about where he thinks the rookie WR's are at vs Kumerow

[Leader]

2 minutes ago, Mazrimiv said:

I expect the team will keep 7 WR's initially, and then make a decision when Jones returns.

Which might make for a good strategic move - i.e. - slide talent to our PS when other teams have already made (initial at least....) decisions on theirs. Wont protect from a "drop and swap" - but we dont live in a perfect world. 

[Leader]

14 minutes ago, Mazrimiv said:

You can put them on the field, but I doubt Rodgers will be looking their way.  His comments about the scout team performance tell you all you need to know about where he thinks the rookie WR's are at vs Kumerow

Well then somebody needs to have a chit chat with Mr. AR.

Okay - so the rookies had a less than stellar practice. Shoot em dead and drag the carcasses away. Not! If EQ is out there getting/making clean breaks off the LOS and beating his man with his speed/size combo - and AR's not throwing the ball his way - cause, wellllll he's AR and EQs not in the perfect spot. Oh well. Davante was a rookie once - probably wasnt perfect - but he showed his talent. He showed growth. He made plays - cause AR threw him the ball.

Janis is gone. Those days of "mistrusting him" are over. In fact.....I saw him make a special teams "tackle" last night (more a push of a guy falling to the ground - but he's got one tackle to his stats) and his receiving stats? Targets: 4. Receptions: 0 - and these represent his TC totals so far.

Add on - btw - what the hell is the scramble drill? Its nothing but WRs running all over the place to find an opening - and GB seems to do a fair amount of it - which is kinda the polar opposite to this "get to your perfect spot or I wont throw you the ball" concept eh?

Like I said: trust the talent. Get em the ball.

[AlexGreen#20]

13 minutes ago, Mazrimiv said:

You can put them on the field, but I doubt Rodgers will be looking their way.  His comments about the scout team performance tell you all you need to know about where he thinks the rookie WR's are at vs Kumerow

If Rodgers is making ****ty plays because he's kicking up a fit that Jake Kumerow, career practice squad player isn't on the team, somebody needs to sit down and set his head straight. 

Rodgers made comments about one practice. I get there's not a lot of news coming out of camp right now, but we can't make mountains out of molehills. 

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

With Jimmy Graham and Marcedes Lewis, along with going back to moving the WR's around into all three spots, i don't think Aaron is going to be complaining about the who makes the bottom end of the WR group.

Adams showed a glimpse of the damage he can do from the slot, and Lewis showed he can be a receiving threat due to his size mismatch.  I have a feeling our tight end production will be much higher this year, and that will open up things for the rest of the offense.

Rodgers will be fine.  

[OneTwoSixFive]

NFL players generally have to endure harder coaching than most of us in other professions would accept. Rodgers comments were a part of that, seeing something he both didn't like and that he believed was unnacceptable due to the players having sheets to tell them what the play was. He felt it was his responsibility as a veteran leader to say something and he did. Perhaps he shouldn't have 'gone public', and maybe, in retrospect he may agree with that (everything he says is recorded/analysed), but though it may be a small deal, it isn't a big one.

We are still in wait and see mode (or I am, anyway) about which receivers to keep, which to release, and which to try and keep on the PS.

My best guess at this time, is that they manage without Davis as punt returner and go a different direction. I'd guess they keep Adams and Cobb (obviously), Allison (obvious to me, for his vet presence this year), Moore (too early to drop a 4th round pick with future potential), MVS, and either ESB or Kumerow if they keep 6 (and both if they keep 7). So far Yancey doesn't seem to have done enough to stick, but a good final two games might change that. He, Lewis and Jennings are chasing PS spots, imo.

[squire12]

Part of the WR debate is where might the rookies WR be in Nov/Dec?  

Give them 2-3 more months of reps, practice, film, coaching and where might they project to be.  As noted by @AlexGreen#20 Kumerow is in his 4th TC, he should look more polished vs the rookies.

Gutekunst and the coaches need to decide both the potential of now and late 2018 and beyond.

[Uffdaswede]

28 minutes ago, OneTwoSixFive said:

NFL players generally have to endure harder coaching than most of us in other professions would accept. Rodgers comments were a part of that, seeing something he both didn't like and that he believed was unnacceptable due to the players having sheets to tell them what the play was. He felt it was his responsibility as a veteran leader to say something and he did. Perhaps he shouldn't have 'gone public', and maybe, in retrospect he may agree with that (everything he says is recorded/analysed), but though it may be a small deal, it isn't a big one.

We are still in wait and see mode (or I am, anyway) about which receivers to keep, which to release, and which to try and keep on the PS.

My best guess at this time, is that they manage without Davis as punt returner and go a different direction. I'd guess they keep Adams and Cobb (obviously), Allison (obvious to me, for his vet presence this year), Moore (too early to drop a 4th round pick with future potential), MVS, and either ESB or Kumerow if they keep 6 (and both if they keep 7). So far Yancey doesn't seem to have done enough to stick, but a good final two games might change that. He, Lewis and Jennings are chasing PS spots, imo.

I agree with your take completely.

(I know I stepped into a hornet’s nest by suggesting Cobb might not be a 100% lock, but no one saw Sitton’s cut coming either.  Sitton’s situation most likely involved a combination of locker room issues and degrading health. As someone pointed out, Cobb probably would already be gone if the team wasn’t sure he’d function just fine in his role for at least another year.)

ESB is the player most likely to survive a trip to the practice squad due to the concerns that every single other team already expressed by passing on him multiple times in the draft.

Kumerow seems more like Joe Callahan than Max McCaffery in the sense that, should things continue as they have been, he has simply performed too well in TC and preseason games to cut him.

I have Kumerow at six and ESB at seven in the power rankings thus far. 

[CWood21]

4 hours ago, Mazrimiv said:

Every year we also have developmental WR's who the fanbase insists will be picked up if they are released, and they rarely are.

Malachi Dupre was the last WR that the Packers exposed to waivers since Charles Johnson.  Outside of those two, I don't think the Packers have really had guys as talented as J'Mon Moore, MVS, or ESB that they could expose to waivers.  That's two WRs in the last 13 years that the Packers exposed to waivers that had significant upside. 

[Mr Anonymous]

The injury could turn into a blessing for the chances of retaining him post cuts. Let's say it knocks him out for 2 weeks which is average time for an SC joint sprain. That takes things right up to cut down day Sept 1. You would think with all those names and younger prospects flying around on cut down day, that teams would be hesitant to drop a player and use a 53-man spot on a 26 year old guy last seen injured. Sad to say for Kumerow, I know.

[ThatJerkDave]

Right now, I think that Kumerow has to make the team.  Much like Myles White a few seasons ago, the guy is doing everything right and producing when his number is called.  He is playing at the same time as all the other WRs except Adams, Cobb, and Allison usually gets pulled a little early as well.  So all of these young WRs are playing the same CBs with the same QBs.

[cannondale]

Who would have thunk there would be a day where our TE group out shined our WR group ??

I'm not so much worried about the numbers game. Those things tend to work themselves out and rarely come back to bite you in the *** too hard. Charles Johnson rings a bell in that regard. My concern is that everyone not named Adams carries with him legit question marks. I literally have no idea what to think of Cobb anymore. I like Allison as a 3 or 4 much better than a 2. After that, it's a literal crapshoot. Not the ideal situation for a guy like MM who likes to play the matchup game. Back in the "olden days' we just straight up out numbered defenses from a talent standpoint at WR. Our 3rd and 4th guy was always better than the defenses 3rd or 4th CB. Always. 

During the Jordy saga, I pointed to the playoff teams who weren't talent rich at the WR position and the revamping of the playbook as reasons to not get overly concerned. 

Our TE's will pick up some of the slack, but gotta admit I'm a bit nervous. I think it all hinges on Cobb. If he resurrects his career, that would have a great domino affect. If he continues his disappearing act, things might be dicey through the air.

 

[craig]

2 hours ago, Mr Anonymous said:

The injury could turn into a blessing for the chances of retaining him post cuts. Let's say it knocks him out for 2 weeks which is average time for an SC joint sprain. That takes things right up to cut down day Sept 1. You would think with all those names and younger prospects flying around on cut down day, that teams would be hesitant to drop a player and use a 53-man spot on a 26 year old guy last seen injured. Sad to say for Kumerow, I know.

This is a good point.  Everybody agrees on two points:

1. We'd like to keep all four of Kumerow and the rookies, on the 63-man, if possible
2. Kumerow is better positioned to play snaps this year, at least early in the year.  

The strong disagreement is on whether guys cut will make it to PS.  Lots of posters argue it will no problem to waive Moore or EQ; other feel strongly to the contrary.

I think the Anonymous point is well taken; if Kumerow misses a game or two, teams may have reduced likelihood to claim him. 

Waiving Kumerow, if you get him to PS, might still provide "4th WR" insurance.  When Graham and the main WR's are healthy, we won't use the 4th WR anyway.  If/when an injury occurs such that you want/need Kumerow, you can call him up then, as needed.  It may well be that somebody else (possibly plural) will need to go IR by that point anyway, so adding him later won't necessarily mean you're needing to cut somebody you love now.  

[Mr Anonymous]

8 minutes ago, craig said:

This is a good point.  Everybody agrees on two points:

1. We'd like to keep all four of Kumerow and the rookies, on the 63-man, if possible
2. Kumerow is better positioned to play snaps this year, at least early in the year.  

The strong disagreement is on whether guys cut will make it to PS.  Lots of posters argue it will no problem to waive Moore or EQ; other feel strongly to the contrary.

I think the Anonymous point is well taken; if Kumerow misses a game or two, teams may have reduced likelihood to claim him. 

Waiving Kumerow, if you get him to PS, might still provide "4th WR" insurance.  When Graham and the main WR's are healthy, we won't use the 4th WR anyway.  If/when an injury occurs such that you want/need Kumerow, you can call him up then, as needed.  It may well be that somebody else (possibly plural) will need to go IR by that point anyway, so adding him later won't necessarily mean you're needing to cut somebody you love now.  

Well stated. And to take it one step further, once you successfully get Kumerow to the practice squad it will be that much easier to have him swap spots with one of the rookies. Once the season starts and you're past cut downs, you bring Kumerow up to the 53 and send one of Moore, MVS, or ESB to the PS.