Brady vs Jordan for 2nd greatest North American Athlete of all-time

[CP3MVP]

1 hour ago, AngusMcFife said:

Jordan was better than every other player at every position. There's no need to compare him to other SGs because he was better than every PG, SF, PF, and C. 

All NBA and pro teams are about positions. You signaled out Brady’s “only” first team all pros. Brady’s competition during his era  at QB craps all over Jordan’s at SG who had 10 first team all nba teams. Competition matters. 

And what era/time was Jordan better than any player at any position? During the 80’s it was magic and bird. If I cite MVP’s that they won over him I’m sure you’ll say that’s a flawed measure and make excuses.

[CP3MVP]

28 minutes ago, childofpudding said:

He didn't win MVP every year so that's not true, according to your logic.

He will make excuses and claim it’s different and a BS media award

[Heinz D.]

On 5/5/2021 at 2:03 AM, Uncle Buck said:

What about Rocky Marciano? 

 

 

You da man, @Uncle Buck.

[AngusMcFife]

1 hour ago, childofpudding said:

He didn't win MVP every year so that's not true, according to your logic.

He won more MVPs than Brady did, in fewer years.

Also its much harder to win MVP in NBA. You are competing with every other position. NFL MVPs are almost always QBs, so you are only competing with 32 other players. 

[AngusMcFife]

1 hour ago, CP3MVP said:

All NBA and pro teams are about positions. You signaled out Brady’s “only” first team all pros. Brady’s competition during his era  at QB craps all over Jordan’s at SG who had 10 first team all nba teams. Competition matters. 

And what era/time was Jordan better than any player at any position? During the 80’s it was magic and bird. If I cite MVP’s that they won over him I’m sure you’ll say that’s a flawed measure and make excuses.

You can compare NBA players because no matter what position, a player can be judged on similar stats (points, shooting %, assists, rebounds, etc). There's no similar metric that allows you to compare how good QB is to a TE, DE, etc.  

[CP3MVP]

1 hour ago, AngusMcFife said:

He won more MVPs than Brady did, in fewer years.

Also its much harder to win MVP in NBA. You are competing with every other position. NFL MVPs are almost always QBs, so you are only competing with 32 other players. 

So do mvp matter or not. Jordan was only the MVP 5 times, so by your logic he was only The best player 5 times. 
 

 

Edited May 10, 2021 by CP3MVP

[CP3MVP]

1 hour ago, AngusMcFife said:

You can compare NBA players because no matter what position, a player can be judged on similar stats (points, shooting %, assists, rebounds, etc). There's no similar metric that allows you to compare how good QB is to a TE, DE, etc.  

So you admit all NBA teams are flawed? I’m asking you what years Jordan was the best player. You shifted to mvps so I’m assuming only 5 times. 
 

 

[childofpudding]

1 hour ago, AngusMcFife said:

He won more MVPs than Brady did, in fewer years.

Also its much harder to win MVP in NBA. You are competing with every other position. NFL MVPs are almost always QBs, so you are only competing with 32 other players. 

That doesn't matter. You said that "Jordan was better than every other player at every position."

That was incorrect, according to your logic. Jordan was not better than every other player at every position every season he played.

I mean, I think these comparisons across sports is dumb, but you just owned yourself with your own logic, so good job with that.

[childofpudding]

1 hour ago, AngusMcFife said:

You can compare NBA players because no matter what position, a player can be judged on similar stats (points, shooting %, assists, rebounds, etc). There's no similar metric that allows you to compare how good QB is to a TE, DE, etc.  

You think you can compare assists, rebounds and shooting percentage between centers and point guards? You clearly don't know anything about basketball.

[Art_Vandalay]

5 hours ago, seminoles1 said:

Like I said, if you want to consider accomplishments AND athletic ability together, then your answer is Ashton Eaton and you shouldn't consider anyone else. You've left yourself no other choice

I’ve never heard of that person but they’re likely one of the hundreds of people that should be considered over Tom Brady in this discussion. Call Brady the best QB and/or football player of all time. Not the greatest athlete.

If there’s some old guy at my rec center who’s played pickle ball for 20 years and has never lost a game, the discussions aren’t going to be, “Man, he’s the greatest athlete I’ve ever seen here”, right? There are sports that inherently require more athleticism. So IMO, golfer, bowler, competitive eater, etc shouldn’t be considered “great athletes.” If we’re saying Brady is an all-time great athlete, then we’re saying anyone ever that has dominated their respective “sport”, regardless of whether they’re fat and slow, should be considered as well. That would be silly.

Edited May 10, 2021 by Art_Vandalay

[Malfatron]

Cal Ripken jr

[seminoles1]

55 minutes ago, Art_Vandalay said:

I’ve never heard of that person but they’re likely one of the hundreds of people that should be considered over Tom Brady in this discussion. Call Brady the best QB and/or football player of all time. Not the greatest athlete.

If there’s some old guy at my rec center who’s played pickle ball for 20 years and has never lost a game, the discussions aren’t going to be, “Man, he’s the greatest athlete I’ve ever seen here”, right? There are sports that inherently require more athleticism. So IMO, golfer, bowler, competitive eater, etc shouldn’t be considered “great athletes.” If we’re saying Brady is an all-time great athlete, then we’re saying anyone ever that has dominated their respective “sport”, regardless of whether they’re fat and slow, should be considered as well. That would be silly.

Ashton Eaton is the 2x Olympic Gold medalist and 2x World Champion in the decathlon, the 2x World Champion and current record holder in the heptathlon, and the only person to ever score more than 9,000 points twice in the decathlon. I hope you know him now because he's your only choice based on your definition.

Yes, because there is a difference between being the greatest athlete and being the most athletic. Do you have Vince Carter higher on your list than Larry Bird? Shawn Kemp higher than Tim Duncan?

Edited May 10, 2021 by seminoles1

[lancerman]

3 hours ago, AngusMcFife said:

He won more MVPs than Brady did, in fewer years.

Also its much harder to win MVP in NBA. You are competing with every other position. NFL MVPs are almost always QBs, so you are only competing with 32 other players. 

Brady plays a sport where only one player has more MVP's than him. Peyton Manning with 5. Everyone else has 3 or less. And there's a lot of people that would argue it became a meme that Peyton won a few that he shouldn't have (08 and 09 were very weak and 03 was a co MVP). 

Jordan played a sport where Kareem has 6 which is more than him and he's tied for 5 with Bill Russell. 

So as far as MVP's go, in their sports they are virtually in the same spot. In fact there are more players with 4 or more MVP's in the NBA than there are in the NFL. So that's a very dubious claim that it's "harder to win an MVP in the NBA. The criteria is very different. You can be the best at your position and a RB can break some amazing record and there is nothing you can do to stop the voters from giving it to them. You also can miss more games in the NBA and still get the MVP. In 2016 Brady was probably the best QB or debateable with Ryan and missing 4 games was held against him

[Danger]

Brady is the GOAT.

Gretzky was good but even Kobe has more championships than him.

[Art_Vandalay]

48 minutes ago, seminoles1 said:

Ashton Eaton is the 2x Olympic Gold medalist and 2x World Champion in the decathlon, the 2x World Champion and current record holder in the heptathlon, and the only person to ever score more than 9,000 points twice in the decathlon. I hope you know him now because he's your only choice based on your definition.

Yes, because there is a difference between being the greatest athlete and being the most athletic. Do you have Vince Carter higher on your list than Larry Bird? Shawn Kemp higher than Tim Duncan?

We’re never going to agree because our definitions of athletes are different. Your definition is “person that plays sport.” Which is perfectly fine. That’s the dictionary’s definition of it. I get it. And I’m not here to argue who the greatest athlete of all time is because lord knows with that definition, there’s an infinite number of candidates. But if I’m going to start a list, I’m going to take into account many different things, and one of the big things is going to be can he move faster than my 50 yo uncle. So, when I see a comparison of two guys that have had comparable success in their respective sport (MJ and Brady) I think it’s silly to imply the guy with very little mobility is a better athlete than someone like MJ.