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49erurtaza

By 49erurtaza
in NFL Draft

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HoboRocket

HoboRocket

Posted
Posted
9 hours ago, HoboRocket said:

I'm going to have to disagree. You almost never see the depth of potential starters that this class has. Yes, you don't have any can't-miss guys. Instead, you have a highly athletic guy withba rocket arm that set the SEC single-season passing touchdown record and elevated his program despite inconsistencies. You have the reigning Heisman trophy winner with legitimate arm talent, who also is intriguing because he's probably faster than Lamar Jackson. You have an electric pocket passer who was in the Heisman discussion and took one of the most-storied programs in the history of football to a new level on offense. You have a quarterback who was trained by David Cutcliffe and is advanced in the mental aspect of the game with an ideal frame for a QB to go with good, but not great arm talent [and was held back by a terrible supporting cast]. You have a QB who took a crappy program like Northwestern to the Big Ten Championship, carrying his team while also setting the record for most consecutive starts by a FBS QB. You also have a bunch of other intriguing players. You have a guy like Ryan Finley who has fantastic accuracy and good intangibles, but the athleticism is average. You have someone like Will Grier, who was productive, has the competitive spirit and "it" factor, but there are questions about arm strength and level of competition. You have an athletic QB who has tremendous potential, having torn up the Big-12 as a freshman, then leading his team to beat undefeated Georgia and Alabama, with pretty good arm strength and fantastic accuracy, but hasn't been able to reach it consistently with a very weak offensive supporting cast and terrible play calling on offense the past year. You have a player who athletically measures like a freaking demigod, a Hercules of sorts, who many scouts liked before they saw exactly how athletically he measured, because he showed some of the best throws in college this past year while winning conference player of the year and - yes, you guessed it - took his team to new heights (the Buffalo Bulls had their first year with double digits wins in the FBS ever, and only their third winning season since 1999).

...more to he added

Also have some pretty great pure athletes with upside and intangibles like Trace McSorley and Easton Stick. Someone who operated successfully in an Air Raid scheme like Gardner Minshew who was even able to do some things that Like Faulk couldn't. This class has plenty of intrigue and depth at a level that I haven't seen before. The main difference is that I'd take a bunch of these guys in the second, wouldn't really jump to grab them at the top of the first. And heck, as far as the "it" factor goes, guys who have drawn rave reviews with their demeanor and work ethic, strong teammates who will carry their team and lead them back into contention, possibly victory while down multiple scores in the fourth quarter, whose on-field persona and attitude gives life to a struggling team - you have Will Grier, Kyler Murray, Clayton Thorson, Tyree Jackson, Easton Stick, and Drew Lock for sure, despite any inconsistencies from any of them. Time will tell how strong this class really is, but its depth of talent elevates its ranking, in my eyes. 

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MWil23

MWil23

Posted
Posted

I get the doubters on Haskins to a point, but here are my thoughts (as an OSU fan, I'll try to stay as unbiased as possible or at least identify my bias throughout):

Pro:

*Haskins is young, has a good frame, and very good to great arm.

*His short and intermediate accuracy is pinpoint, allowing for RAC opportunities (It's no coincidence that the year after JT Barrett leaves, multiple OSU WR's who were identified as underachievers (Campbell, McLauren, etc.) are now getting 1st and 2nd day buzz)

*He has production to match the measurables, breaking many of Drew Bree's records.

*Good pocket mobility

*Got better as the season went in identifying pressure pre-snap, especially against the blitz

*Good job presnap identifying coverages

Con:

*Very hit or miss deep accuracy

*Not a great athlete (however, I also believe a lot of this has to do with the OSU "mobile QB" and system they've had for over a decade. If you play straight up man without accounting for him with some type of defender, he'll gain some yards if people are covered.)

*Only has 1 year of starting experience

*Spread system/not under center

*Elongated throwing motion

*Inconsistent against pressure (TCU and PSU weren't good for him until the 4th quarter)

*Inconsistent albeit not overly sloppy footwork (I'm looking at you Drew Lock)

The Bottom Line:

If you like/love "Hurricane Dwayne" as a prospect, you see Ben Roethlisberger. If you don't like him as a prospect, you see "Bad Jameis Winston". Personally, I think that his floor is in the "Andy Dalton tier" simply due to his great short and intermediate accuracy to go with his good to great arm strength.

 

 

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BoltsFan937

BoltsFan937

Posted
Posted
18 minutes ago, MWil23 said:

I get the doubters on Haskins to a point, but here are my thoughts (as an OSU fan, I'll try to stay as unbiased as possible or at least identify my bias throughout):

Pro:

*Haskins is young, has a good frame, and very good to great arm.

*His short and intermediate accuracy is pinpoint, allowing for RAC opportunities (It's no coincidence that the year after JT Barrett leaves, multiple OSU WR's who were identified as underachievers (Campbell, McLauren, etc.) are now getting 1st and 2nd day buzz)

*He has production to match the measurables, breaking many of Drew Bree's records.

*Good pocket mobility

*Got better as the season went in identifying pressure pre-snap, especially against the blitz

*Good job presnap identifying coverages

Con:

*Very hit or miss deep accuracy

*Not a great athlete (however, I also believe a lot of this has to do with the OSU "mobile QB" and system they've had for over a decade. If you play straight up man without accounting for him with some type of defender, he'll gain some yards if people are covered.)

*Only has 1 year of starting experience

*Spread system/not under center

*Elongated throwing motion

*Inconsistent against pressure (TCU and PSU weren't good for him until the 4th quarter)

*Inconsistent albeit not overly sloppy footwork (I'm looking at you Drew Lock)

The Bottom Line:

If you like/love "Hurricane Dwayne" as a prospect, you see Ben Roethlisberger. If you don't like him as a prospect, you see "Bad Jameis Winston". Personally, I think that his floor is in the "Andy Dalton tier" simply due to his great short and intermediate accuracy to go with his good to great arm strength.

 

 

I don't remember McLaurin or Campbell getting that 1st/2nd round buzz until after the season and the post season circuit began?  McLaurin particularly at the Senior Bowl and then both faired well at the combine.  My point is, it wasn't like both guys went for 80-100 catches with a 1000+ yards and 10 TDs because Haskins was the QB

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SmittyBacall

SmittyBacall

Posted
Posted
31 minutes ago, MWil23 said:

If you like/love "Hurricane Dwayne" as a prospect, you see Ben Roethlisberger.

I don't see the Big Ben comparison. Ben's mobility and and ability to throw off platform and win off script separate the two as prospects. I kind of what to say I see Eli Manning in Dwayne's game more than Winston or Roethlisberger. 

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MWil23

MWil23

Posted
Posted
11 minutes ago, BoltsFan937 said:

I don't remember McLaurin or Campbell getting that 1st/2nd round buzz until after the season and the post season circuit began? 

Campbell absolutely was. With his speed and athleticism alone he was. McLaurin was not.

11 minutes ago, BoltsFan937 said:

McLaurin particularly at the Senior Bowl and then both faired well at the combine. 

Very true.

11 minutes ago, BoltsFan937 said:

My point is, it wasn't like both guys went for 80-100 catches with a 1000+ yards and 10 TDs because Haskins was the QB

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/parris-campbell-1.html

LOL, that's EXACTLY what happened with Campbell. Check it out. Campbell's catches more than doubled, his TD went from 3 to 12, and his yardage doubled!

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/terry-mclaurin-1.html

Check out McLaurin too...yardage and TD's almost DOUBLE.

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BoltsFan937

BoltsFan937

Posted
Posted
55 minutes ago, MWil23 said:

Campbell absolutely was. With his speed and athleticism alone he was. McLaurin was not.

Very true.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/parris-campbell-1.html

LOL, that's EXACTLY what happened with Campbell. Check it out. Campbell's catches more than doubled, his TD went from 3 to 12, and his yardage doubled!

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/terry-mclaurin-1.html

Check out McLaurin too...yardage and TD's almost DOUBLE.

You got me on Campbell, I didn't do my homework on that one in terms of the stats. However, I would counter argue that his catches were mostly manufactured on screens, crosses...etc and his yards were largely compiled through YAC.  Which is more of a credit to him, than Haskins.  McLaurin (and I love Terry McLaurin), 35-701-(I can't remember 11/12 TDs), those are more of the pro style throws I would give credit to Haskins for.  I'm not against Dwayne, I'm a huge Buckeye fan and hope he succeeds.  I just have my questions coming from that offense and only one year starting with him.  I will certainly concede to you though that the receivers had better years with Dwayne than JT (great kid, hot garbage QB). 

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EL Guapo

EL Guapo

Posted
Posted

This is Dave Te on Haskins

While he could end up doing an Aaron Rodgers like fall on draft day, a few obvious things say it could be opposite. Miami is in pursuit of a QB & they like the kid, but both them & Washington are in the thought process they might have to trade up to get him or Lock. Miami has a pretty intense offer if the Jets are willing to move, which all indications say is likely.
as for Haskins at 6 or 17, I do not make guarantees, but for the reports I have to provide the team on draft day, Haskins never came up in the talks.

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NVRamsFan

NVRamsFan

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, MOSteelers56 said:

Lawrence next to Aaron Donald? That would be horrifying for O-lines. 

I certainly would like having those two coached by Wade. Also with Snead we draft almost exclusively guys we’ve met with. In addition every one of our picks last year were via trade, either they were other teams original picks out in one cas our pick we sent away and eventually got back. Something to think of when mocking to us. I rarely see mocks involving trades and were one of the most likely to trade.

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minutemancl

minutemancl

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, EL Guapo said:

This is Dave Te on Haskins

While he could end up doing an Aaron Rodgers like fall on draft day, a few obvious things say it could be opposite. Miami is in pursuit of a QB & they like the kid, but both them & Washington are in the thought process they might have to trade up to get him or Lock. Miami has a pretty intense offer if the Jets are willing to move, which all indications say is likely.
as for Haskins at 6 or 17, I do not make guarantees, but for the reports I have to provide the team on draft day, Haskins never came up in the talks.

Please let this mean Grier at 37 rather than Jones at 17.

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